You’re an aspie.

Hurr durr we can’t afford to feed old people is the weakest concern troll I’ve seen you make in months. This is the country that throws away half of all the food we produce. This is the country that spends billions on food aid to other countries. This is the country that has the most fat people.

Wringing your hands and saying “this is too expensive” is just as dumb as saying “I think you’re a religious kook therefore I don’t think you should be allowed to follow your traditions.” Your steak and lobster troll was stupid too, since it is dealt with handily by prison officials every year, and I don’t know if you’ve ever eaten kosher but you don’t eat steak and fucking lobster. This shit about efficiency is smokescreen for do “what I like”, which if you truly cared about saving money at the expense of feeding old people - which I highly doubt many people do, because they’re fucking old people - you’d be agitating for soylent fucking green.

But no. You assumed I was rich. You assumed that meant it was okay for my grandmother to feed on caviar and the finest of chocolate mousse, and if your philosophical underpinnings tell you that it’s okay to grind the noses of poor people into the traditional american cheeseburger rather than something they’ve eaten their whole lives and want to eat again before they die, then fuck you.

Cry all you want about me casting you as old folk hater. At some point, you can’t be all for that shit without turning into a cartoon villain.

And weren’t you just arguing on the side of the religious folks in that other thread? The thing with the prayer on the wall? How do you even keep your shit straight?

He doesn’t. He simply always stands on the exact opposite side of what the rest of us generally consider reasonable. He’s a contrarian just for the sake of being contrary.

If he really wants to worship at the altar of Mammon and “sustainability”, that’s fine. But the price is literally taking food out of old people’s mouths, and no amount of complaining about ad hominems can obscure that fact.

He likes playing Devil’s Advocate. :)

We’re also the nation which has $15 trillion in debt.

The fact that we waste money is not an excuse to not even consider what we spend money on.

But it’s different, because I don’t need to pay for you to follow your religious traditions… unless I’m paying to feed you, and your religion prescribes requirements which increase the cost of feeding you.

Your steak and lobster troll was stupid too, since it is dealt with handily by prison officials every year, and I don’t know if you’ve ever eaten kosher but you don’t eat steak and fucking lobster.

But the food does generally cost more than its non-kosher counterpart, due to the additional preparatory requirements.

As I said though, if there are no cost increases, then it doesn’t matter. The state isn’t spending any more resources.

But no. You assumed I was rich. You assumed that meant it was okay for my grandmother to feed on caviar and the finest of chocolate mousse, and if your philosophical underpinnings tell you that it’s okay to grind the noses of poor people into the traditional american cheeseburger rather than something they’ve eaten their whole lives and want to eat again before they die, then fuck you.

I didn’t assume you were rich. I assumed you had enough money to facilitate the decisions about how you would allocate your resources to keep your grandmother in comfort. Which you apparently did.

Cry all you want about me casting you as old folk hater. At some point, you can’t be all for that shit without turning into a cartoon villain.

And weren’t you just arguing on the side of the religious folks in that other thread? The thing with the prayer on the wall? How do you even keep your shit straight?

That’s what is so funny.

In that thread, I found it inoffensive for a sign which was there for 50 years to continue being there… Although, if you’ll note, I also pointed out that I would be opposed to something which actually cost me my tax dollars. I believe the example I used was, “If they wanted to build a big ass golden Jesus statue, I’d oppose it, because I’m not interested in spending my money on that.”

And yet, seemingly everyone was all about ripping that sign down, because it constituted a state sponsorship of a religion.

But here, where we are talking about the state actually spending money specifically to support religious beliefs of a specific group, no one seems to bat an eye.

It’s also funny because the (obviously absurd) notion of the steak and lobster made up religion is discounted as disingenuous, and yet the idea that the sign must be removed because of the possibility that you would have to put up signs for the FSM, was absolutely accepted… despite being the exact same argument.

He doesn’t. He simply always stands on the exact opposite side of what the rest of us generally consider reasonable. He’s a contrarian just for the sake of being contrary.

While I absolutely do like to argue with the majority because it allows me to learn more about that position, in this case my original gut instinct really was that I wouldn’t see a huge problem with the state restricting its meal provisions to things which were medically necessary. You have to draw the line somewhere, and that seems like the most concrete and definable line.

But, like I said before, if it’s really not any increase in cost, then I could care less. I certainly don’t support preventing someone from exercising their religious beliefs just because. At the same time though, it’s not my responsibility to fund those religious beliefs.

It seems like folks are suggesting that it’s ok for the state to fund someone’s religious beliefs, if they’re old.

I’d just like to point out that our federal “debt” is just “net private savings in dollars” by another name. It will never EVAR have to be paid off entirely and it would be silly to attempt such a thing, because last I heard people/institutions are perfectly happy holding U.S. bonds at a super-safe rate of interest.

It’s more that this exact issue is dealt with quite handily on a regular basis by other systems.

and yet the idea that the sign must be removed because of the possibility that you would have to put up signs for the FSM, was absolutely accepted… despite being the exact same argument.

That wasn’t actually the conclusion of the conversation; it was me saying that I could see a reasonable alternative outlook vis-a-vis genuinely-held beliefs, which your steak & lobster example does not count as.

Why do you people still respond to him of you all know what he is???

Oh, and your complaining about tradition was silly. Since, by and large, nursing homes serve what are typically traditionally american meals.

I’m sure they could find cheaper alternatives, such as curries and ramen, but then that wouldn’t be traditional. Wait, why aren’t you making this argument? Oh, right, because as long as it isn’t your tradition that’s being challenged you don’t give a shit.

But the flying spaghetti monster isn’t a genuinely held belief either.

Regardless, the steak and lobster was not intended to be presented as a case that I was actually afraid of occurring. It was merely intended as an example in order to prompt the explanation of why it could be discounted.

From a practical perspective though, I’m satisfied with the prison based solution of saying, “Well, unless you can prove you ate this outside this place, we’re not gonna give it to you now.”

To limit it to more realistic examples though, given that people have various weird diets now, would the state also be expected to support something like Atkins, if for some reason some person actually did have that kind of diet prior to entering the system?

I’m sure they could find cheaper alternatives, such as curries and ramen, but then that wouldn’t be traditional. Wait, why aren’t you making this argument? Oh, right, because as long as it isn’t your tradition that’s being challenged you don’t give a shit.

That’s fair. Honestly, I like curries and ramen, but see your point here.

However, at the same time, if someone came from some other country and enjoyed some less common ethnic food, they actually wouldn’t have their tradition respected, right? I mean, the state isn’t going to go out of its way to specifically prepare someone Indian food, just because it’s their tradition, right?

Slippery slope nonsense.

The simpler answer is that if an authority responsible for feeding people gave people food that violated their beliefs then those people would have standing to sue. Not providing kosher food to those who requested it would be an expensive lawsuit waiting to happen.

Geez, I hate doing this, but, based on what? What would be the legal standing for the suit?

Better cut out this making sense stuff or they’ll revoke your P&R privileges.

Stop discussing policies and issues and concentrate on the important thing: Newt lost tonight!

Meanwhile, Romney takes Flo-rida.

An interesting fact out of tonight’s Florida numbers. Despite the initial post-SC hoopla about Newtmentum making it a race, turnout was down by 15% versus 2008, when McCain beat Romney in Florida 36% to 31%.

And just stop and think about that. Today, the GOP base considers Romney and McCain to be the far left wing of the party, barely worthy of the name Republican.

Yet last time having two RINOs duke it out actually got more people to go to the polls.

Maybe, just maybe, actual GOP voters prefer moderate RINOs to the base-pandering clown show we got this year?

Naw, that’s crazy talk. Clearly the GOP needs to veer even further to the right!

A little misleading. Romney ran last time as a conservative, since his principle opponents at the start of the race were McCain and (hilarious as it is to remember) Guiliani. He’s shifted to the center this year because his opposition was a clown car full of hard right wingers. Romney is nothing if not a political chameleon.

Guiliani’s complete inability to get traction is goddamn hilarious. It makes me think that Christie isn’t going to go anywhere - too liberal!

God, what a wonderfully apt metaphor.