2017: Whither Democrats?

[gman1225]

Yep, I’m certainly the one here using insults, broad-based slurs, and taunts. Correct diagnosis! Does anyone else here disagree with the notion that anyone who voted for Obama in 2008 and 2012, and then Trump in 2016, is automatically a white supremacist ? Or is that just me? I’m actually curious how big the bubble is.

[forgeforsaken]

Timestamps are a funny thing. Some people keep odd hours or I dunno, just don’t live in the country they are talking about nonstop.

[abidingdude]

+1

It’s beyond annoying. It used to be contained to mostly one thread but it’s spreading like an infection.

[MarinusWA]

Then someone says he “supports” Trump in any way? Tribalist! Safe to ignore! It’s adorable and sad at the same time.

You self-identified as a tribalist. I’m just following your lead.

[gman1225]

Russian bots, man! Computers keep strange hours.

It’s beyond annoying. It used to be contained to mostly one thread but it’s spreading like an infection.

Can’t have dissent in the bubble. Here you were, just calling all Trump voters white supremacists, and someone had to come in here and disagree.

[Menzo]

Can’t have dissent in the bubble.

Was wondering when you’d pull out that chestnut. Do you know how many people have come and gone thinking this is a “bubble”? You’re just more grist for the mill, my friend.

[ArmandoPenblade]

I mean it would be a better forum if he weren’t here and a better world if he couldn’t vote.

And before someone steps in to assure gman I’m joking, I’m really not. I’m very okay being the liberal villain he’s so desperate to fear.

[Soapyfrog]

You’re a mind reader, too! Honestly, one of the biggest reasons people I know support Trump, myself included, is that he stands up to this kind of politically correct bullying.

This is just an incredibly poor reason to support any candidate. You should be supporting a candidate because you agree with their platform and policy positions and whether you think they can make good decisions.

Besides which Trump is the ultimate bully… He constantly makes unwarranted personal attacks and seeks to use his powers to punish those he does not like. He is very frequently punching down like a classic bully.

I find your rationale for supporting trump to be very weak, and therefore suspect.

[gman1225]

I don’t know that it’s that poor of a reason, given the political climate leading up to his election and what’s happening internationally. Europe is essentially committing cultural suicide at the hands of unchecked immigration, which has led crime and even terrorism to spread out of control – all the while, its inhabitants balk at any mention of immigration as a factor in the crime, for fear of being labeled racist. It’s a stunning and sad state of affairs. When certain topics – or even political affiliations, as on this forum – become politically incorrect, there are very real consequences. Trump’s willingness to say what others cannot is very much a legitimate reason to support him in this climate.

I agree with you that Trump is a bully, which is a bad character trait when he does it, just like it’s bad when the posters here do it. But I would take having an ass as a president over the alternatives I’ve just outlined.

Was wondering when you’d pull out that chestnut. Do you know how many people have come and gone thinking this is a “bubble”? You’re just more grist for the mill, my friend.

No idea what this means

[Menzo]

Europe is essentially committing cultural suicide at the hands of unchecked immigration, which has led crime and even terrorism to spread out of control – all the while, its inhabitants balk at any mention of immigration as a factor in the crime, for fear of being labeled racist.

Pro-tip: when you use the words “cultural suicide” in this context, you’re a racist. Seriously.

[gman1225]

You’ve descended into self-parody. I regret that you are so closed-minded about very important issues.

[Menzo]

uh huh.

[gman1225]

Immigration can cause problems, but if you can’t even broach the subject without walking on eggshells and being labeled by condescending progressives like yourself, people less patient than me won’t bother talking about these issues with you. They’ll just vote for people like Trump. And that’s how you get Trump.

PS - Apropos of nothing, anchor on Fox News just said this is a historic meeting between two dictators in Singapore. Great stuff

[Menzo]

Immigration can cause problems, but if you can’t even broach the subject without walking on eggshells and being labeled by condescending progressives like yourself, people less patient than me won’t bother talking about them with you. They’ll just vote for people like Trump. And that’s how to get Trump.

You wanted to “begin” a conversation while using the words “cultural suicide”? That’s not how you begin a conversation. You are the cliche here, man.

You are literally sea lioning us.

[gman1225]

Declining birth rates, increasing crime and terrorism, rampaging distrust, alienation, a total lack of willingness to do anything about all the above-- I would absolutely call those elements of cultural decline. Just because a culture is mostly white doesn’t mean it’s not worth protecting.

[Menzo]

OK, Steve King, I totally get what you are.

[Soapyfrog]

Europe is essentially committing cultural suicide at the hands of unchecked immigration, which has led crime and even terrorism to spread out of control

I pretty sure this isn’t true. Immigration is not “unchecked” and crime is not out of control because of it.

[Menzo]

I pretty sure this isn’t true. Immigration is not “unchecked” and crime is not out of control because of it.

He knows this. These are all scare words. I am certain he’s going to point to roving gangs of rape-crazy migrants in Sweden. Sweden is a popular topic for white nationalists, because it represents The Fatherland more than most European countries. It has now become a wasteland of crime thanks to the non-whites.

And of course none of it is being reported, so you can’t actually prove it’s not true.

[gman1225]

The problem is I have data where you just have condescension.

Take Germany.:

Germany Must Come to Terms With Refugee Crime

Conducted by Christian Pfeiffer, Dirk Baier and Soeren Kliem of the Zurich University of Applied Sciences, the government-commissioned study uses material from Germany’s fourth-most-populous state, Lower Saxony, home to Volkswagen. About 750,000 of its 8 million residents don’t have German citizenship, and, according to official data for the end of 2016, about 170,000 of them had applied for asylum. That’s also the fourth-highest number in Germany. The researchers asked for data that specifically concerned asylum applicants, both successful and unsuccessful, who had arrived in 2015 and 2016. The state police – in keeping with the unspoken taboo – hadn’t published such statistics, but they obliged the research team. It turned out the asylum seekers had reversed the decreasing violent crime trend in Lower Saxony. While such crime went down by 21.9 percent between 2007 and 2014, it was up again by 10.4 percent by the end of 2016. Some 83 percent of the cases were solved – and 92.1 percent of the increase was attributable to the newcomers.

That’s a number the anti-immigrant Alternative for Germany, which got into parliament last year thanks to its vocal opposition to Chancellor Angela Merkel’s decision to let in more than a million asylum seekers, could inscribe on its banner. Other data points are also damning. Between 2014 and 2016, the share of solved violent crimes attributed to asylum seekers increased to 13.3 percent from 4.3 percent – a disproportionately high share compared with the state’s foreign population.

The breakdown of specific crimes committed by the asylum seekers is equally thought-provoking. In some 91 percent of murders and three-quarters of cases involving grave bodily damage, the victims are other migrants. Yet in 70 percent of robberies and 58.6 percent of rape and sexual assault cases, the victims are German. The explanations are intuitive. Asylum seekers often share cramped quarters, which frequently leads to conflicts. For months after their arrival, they are forbidden to work, and their language skills and status often prevent employment long after that restriction is lifted – so robbers are motivated by jealousy of the locals and a lack of legitimate ways to make money. As for the sex crimes, it’s disturbing to think that it reflects behavior that would go unpunished, or is even encouraged, at home; it’s certainly the case that the refugees are often uncertain how to behave with local women – and many of them didn’t bring their own.

I’m not sure if this is still racist or not, but those are facts, and I’m pretty sure those can’t be racist.

[CraigM]

Not to mention that citing declining birth rates is a nonsensical point. Is Japan comitting ‘cultural suicide’? If there is a concern about decline, the solution for lower birth rates is not less immigration. It is, in fact, more economically. Birth rates are intrinsically linked to economic prosperity, as Per capita GDP goes up, birth rates go down.

Additionally, vis a vis terrorism, if you asked me to trade, as an American, the terrorist incidents I. Europe with the mass shootings in America, straight up? I think we’d win that. Hell you are more likely to be killed by police in America, especially if you are black, than you are by a terrorist in Europe.