All-purpose gun legislation thread


#5846

Only if you have morals or actually believe the shit you say.

I mean… she used to be a liberal. I’m fairly sure her only ideology is whatever someone tells her it is this week.


#5848

Kind of surprised that the whole “printable gun” ballyhoo hasn’t come up here yet.

This is effectively a rehash of the same debate back in 2013 when this same group wanted to release plans for a 3D-printable gun and the Obama administration used international treaties to shut them down. Trump’s administration has declined to pursue the matter, so a few States have taken up the fight.

In my opinion, it’s a hopeless battle – a delaying action only. The plans are already out there if you look hard enough. That’s not to say that the release shouldn’t be fought, but I think that the energy should be turned into making it illegal (or maybe illegalER) to own an unregistered 3D-printed firearm.


#5849

Yeah, I’m not sure what they can do about it. I think this is a lot like the pipe bomb plans you can find everywhere. Pipe bombs are dead simple to make (as long you ignore the inherent danger of messing with homemade explosives) so the crime is put on the person making them, not the person publishing instructions.


#5850

I guess this goes here?


#5851

Plus the plans were already released because of a previous decision.

I love how the narrative is that they’re plastic and omg airplanes or something.

Cause bullets don’t have metal in them.


#5852

You are legally allowed to manufacture your own firearms.

It is already illegal to make or own fully plastic firearms that are undetectable to metal detectors.

There’s no real threat here, and I’m not really Keen on my state blocking access to sections of the internet containing information they think is harmful. That’s the kind of thing China does.


#5853

Yup. In the late 70s, a Princeton physics student tried publish a paper on how to build a nuclear bomb. The FBI was not amused and tried to stop it being published, ultimately it was. The hard part of a nuclear bomb isn’t the info on how to build it is obtaining the uranium or plutonium.

Thoughtful article by David French, on 3-D guns


#5854

I haven’t been following this too closely. Doesn’t the printed gun need a metal barrel insert and a metal firing pin at the very least?


#5855

I thought they were just approved for download a few weeks or months ago. I guess this is judge #374 in the appeals process.


#5856

It needs a metal firing pin, but technically it can fire with a plastic barrel.

But, of course, this means that the barrel is pretty huge, in order to not just blow up in your hand… Which makes the “undetectable” gun a giant blocky thing. And it still has a decent chance of just blowing up in your hand.

In order to actually make reliable firearms, you aren’t using some kind of maker bot 3d printer. You need pretty hard core stuff, to be able to print stuff flawlessly enough with materials that can handle the stress.

At which point you could just buy a gun for a trivial fraction of the effort and price of 3d printing one.

Folks are freaking out over crap like “instructions for printing an AR15!”

It’s literally a high resolution laser scan of an AR15. You can’t print that in plastic and have it work. You would need a metal printer, which costs a fortune.


#5857

So it’s a zip gun. Which, as I’ve mentioned before, means no rifling. The actual bullet tumbles and can make a real nasty wound. Keyhole wound. And the second shot, if there is one will most likely destroy the gun. It reminds me of the gun that John Malkovich used in the movie In the Line of Fire.


#5858

Yeah, the one all plastic gun i saw, “the liberator” which was one if not the first ones made, is huge and bulky, and has what are effectively disposable barrels, since they are either gonna blow up on the first shot, or the second.

A more reasonable option would be a hybrid, where you use actual metal parts, but use a printer to make a housing assembly for them… But at that point you are effectively just making cosmetic crap.


#5859

#5860

Effectively a crappy Glock. I remember when those first came out we heard the same stuff about sneaking them onto planes and crap.


#5861

To me the funny part here is that everyone seems focused on it as a gun issue, when I consider it a First Amendment issue. Computer code is speech (it sure as hell must be, if companies are people and money is speech). Its a recipe, just like publishing a recipe for apple pie on the Internet.


#5862

Not according to the International Traffic in Arms Regulation. All sorts of software is classified as armaments; in this case, I’m not sure that is incorrect.


#5863

And it absolutely is.

All the gun issues are essentially trivial. They don’t actually matter or affect anything.

But the first amendment issues are pretty key. The government should not be allowed to censor speech on the grounds that it poses a risk to the public, because a tyranical government would use that justification to ban any kind of speech that threatened their power.

ITAR restrictions are generally applied to stuff that the government played a role in developing.


#5864

Oh now I remember. The feds allowed this to protect the rest of their regulations. I finally read the article and I see this is the states seeking a ban.

I’m very angry I had to read the article. I was forced to read the new nonsense phrase “3D ghost guns.”


#5865

ITAR restrictions were the basis of the original ban that Trump reversed.


#5866

But you can still print the part that usually requires being serial numbered and registered, which gets around some requirements federally but not necessarily in every state. I’m referring to the lower receiver. There are also supposed 3D printed bump stocks, which again would run afoul of some state laws.

Really I’m in semi-agreement with Tin:

Perhaps not making them illegal, but the lack of registration for them illegal with stiff penalties. Why still allow them? Because if there is one lobbying block that we have repeatedly heard about as nearly completely evil, it’s the fucking gun manufacturers lobby.