Can we pass this one, humans? I can help a little but destiny obviously hates us and it feels like they still have 20 cards to use.
PFhhhhhtttttttbbbt. :)
What he said.
I’m 80% sure that Jorn and soon are going to just Treachery flip you to death for the rest of the game.
It is your most abundant colours, unless you’re hoarding your cards for some malfeasance, cylon!
There is an interesting twist to this turn, though. I can say no more.
Faust gets to choose between Cylon refinery and Cylon refinery?
edit: can’t be, as that gives the Admiral a choice. I wonder what surprises Destiny has in store.
Answering the question on whether this variant was a bad idea.
I’m a bit out of ideas for actions. Even the bad ones.
I don’t think it’s a bad rule variant. I think starting with two Cylons should be a re-deal of Loyalty cards, though. Every time it’s happened so far, humanity has flat out been crushed.
I mean at this point I sincerely doubt they’ll need to flee to their Fleet.
Has there been a human victory with 2 Cylons at the outset?
It’s a shame to eliminate the uncertainty of 2 cylons, although it’s a good play to just assume one Cylon pre sleeper, so that might be a good house rule.
Should the converse apply? always ensure at least 1 Cylon before sleeper?
No.
Is it really, though? 3 people are guaranteed to lose from the beginning.
Possibly. Human victories usually come when there are no Cylons until the Sleeper Phase.
Well now I’m of the opinion that the starting Loyalty deal should always involve 1 and only 1 Cylon card. Redo the whole process if otherwise.
I mean, I can’t imagine that jeffrey, Perky and rowe are enjoying this at all.
Maybe in the event we have a double Cylon draw at the start or a 0 Cylon draw, there could be some sort of resource bonus or penalty to be put into effect once the Sleeper phase is hit. Kept secret, then revealed at that point. Not sure if that would make much of a difference either way though.
I like the idea of uncertainty but I also dislike the sheer overwhelming despair of being a human both times we had a double Cylon game. Just feels like you never have a chance.
OR a mystery special guest 6th player is added at the Sleeper phase, on the opposite side. 4 humans vs 2 Cylons with a huge head start? 3 Cylons try vainly to undo the progress 5 humans working together made?
Spoiler: The Destination deck is about to screw humanity even harder.
I also remember one or two games where the cylons ended up a bit bored after being in the fleet for ages. I haven’t played enough to have much of an opinion, but the fun seems to be when you’re spending turn after turn second-guessing who the cylons are as some disasters happen and others are avoided. It seems to me that reducing the possibilities of perfect reveal storms would be a good idea, but I’m not seeing how.
26 and 27 were both 1 Cylon starts, yeah? And two of the closest games I’ve seen so far.
We’ve already tried changing the dials, adding Pegasus…adding the CFB to get rid of all the Cylon attack crisis cards…I’m not sure what else there is to do, really.
Holding a player in reserve would be difficult and probably a little too unfair :)
The one (and only) guaranteed Cylon pre-sleeper might work. I think we’re hit on a really good balance with the CFB otherwise.
On the other hand, both Jorn and soon this game independently decided to play aggressively, instead of the usual ‘uh oh I need to conceal myself forever’ play that usually happens. They had the cards and have your number. I was happy to see them take the reins and just go for it…see what happens.
It’s tough. There’s no elegant solution to that.
The recourse for humans is if both Cylon players don’t realize there is two cylons active. Once both know, then the ability to act overtly is expanded. All checks that force normal restraint go out the window.
I have only one time done a loyalty redraw, and that was an instance where both President and Admiral would have been Cylon from the start (this was a while ago, pre CAG), and may have even had consecutive turns. I never flagged it as such, just a ‘let me deal the initial hand and loyalty and holy shit that is going to be a short game, let’s reshuffle that’. Couldn’t even tell you which game at this point, as it was before the first board even.
On the one hand I don’t have a solid solution. Only shuffling in a single loyalty pre sleeper makes the odds of a pre sleeper Cylon less likely. And I don’t feel that zero pre sleeper Cylons is nearly a problem on the scale of two. Zero can be overcome. Especially with the CFB and permanent civilian ships. Hard, perhaps, but it doesn’t sap agency the way tow pre sleeper Cylons does from team human. Especially when one is Admiral.
The trouble with things like guaranteeing 1 and only 1 Cylon is it does somewhat reduce the paranoia aspect. No longer is there a ‘they’re suspicious but if they’re not a Cylon we just shot ourselves in the foot, better wait to be sure’. You know there is a Cylon, so it increases incentives to be aggressive about that. Less risk you were wrong and hosed yourself.
And the resources idea is tricky. That is a significant bit of information! Admittedly I don’t feel bad about the idea of a resource boost if two Cylons exist pre sleeper, especially if they go active like this. But the inverse im really uncertain with.
It is very difficult. I was reluctant to continue after the starting Loyalty draw here, but I’ve always ‘let the cards fall where they fall’.
I have a few ideas…
One is possibly to add the Sympathizer variant. I hate it but it’s a thing that might work.
Two is to…hear me out. Put the Cylon Leaders back in, but give them Hostile/Friendly agendas depending on the starting Loyalty…problem with that is that they would know what’s going on. Perhaps only give them Friendly agendas at the Sleeper Phase, or do some magical balancing composition of agendas that I can’t think of off the top of my head.
Or…you all could pick someone that draws freakin’ Engineering cards too…that might help.
Too many BSG forum games where the players don’t look at the card distribution and think about what might happen if each player became/is a Cylon.
The damage on Galactica right now is probably permanent unless Perky decides to Politics CP his way to Repair Monster.
My best balance idea is to involve the Sympathizer somehow. Or possibly fudge with the negative check Treachery thing again. I don’t know, it’s rough.
If we guarantee 1 Cylon, they won’t dare to reveal themselves in any way until 4 Distance.
If we keep things the way they are, we tend to get Humanity cruising to the Sleeper Phase and then the Cylons being hard-pressed to pull off a win.
Balance is hard in a forum game of a board game where you can’t watch and see if someone looks guilty or accidentally says something they regret.
Also your bright orange avatar freaks me out.