ie. the Brexit party is full of evil:
wavey
4731
Something I had completely missed (apologies if this is widely known) - the terms of the October extension specifically forbid any renegotiation of the withdrawal agreement.
https://data.consilium.europa.eu/doc/document/XT-20013-2019-INIT/en/pdf
- This extension excludes any re-opening of the Withdrawal Agreement. Any unilateral
commitment, statement or other act by the United Kingdom should be compatible with the
letter and the spirit of the Withdrawal Agreement, and must not hamper its
implementation. Such an extension cannot be used to start negotiations on the future
relationship.
Which should make the Tory leadership race a little more interesting - if the contenders can’t campaign on some imaginary renegotiation whereupon the EU promises us never-ending unicorns and rainbows, then maybe they will get more specific about how they propose to resolve the situation?
If the withdrawal agreement can’t get through parliament - and recent history has shown it can’t - that leaves: no-deal (disaster, but the default position), revoke (hugely unlikely without a motivating crisis, such as impending no-deal), general election to change the parliamentary arithmetic (might not change anything, might usher in PM Corbyn), or second referendum (cleaves the Tory party in two, with the BxP waiting to mop up any defectors).
Anyway, I need to get back to building my bunker.
I read today’s Guardian piece on Jeremy Hunt’s plan to put together a new negotiating team and get a better agreement, and I wonder whether these people are trying to fool the voters or themselves. Can he really believe that the problem is May just didn’t get the better deal which was always there for the taking?
rho21
4733
The civil service nicknamed him the Hulture Secretary for a reason.
wavey
4734
I guess my list of options did miss out “ignore reality and carry on regardless” or, more charitably, “seek a further extension with the express purpose of renegotiating.” But that would be entirely up to the EU to grant, and the idea of further extensions would likely go down quite badly with the Tory party membership.
I think you’re right though, this is the best deal available given May’s red lines - I can see a much better deal (i.e. a softer Brexit) being available should any of those disappear. So the question to Hunt or any other candidate must be: which of the red lines will you change?
It couldnt be more of a vindication of our concerns and complaints about Labour.
It’s a statutory investigation under law, with full legal disclosure etc. It only became a formal investigation after considerable information was provided and/or leaked from HQ, proof that the the very highest levels of the party at a governance and compliance level were protecting anti-Semites and racists.
It doesn’t matter what he believes. It is essential to the short term survival of the Conservative Party, at least under a non-no-deal leader, that voters believe it. And that’s the only thing that matters to these people.
Yes, i don’t really wonder whether he’s trying to fool the voters.
The Tories are well beyond the point of “Brexit cannot fail; it can only be failed.” Which means they’ll blame everyone but themselves.
kedaha
4739
An investigation that hasn’t even begun yet is already a “vindication” of your opinion.
How can you not be aware of just how much in common you have with alt-right types? C.f. your response to the Reddit poll
Oh, the guy who thought Jackie Walker said nothing wrong, even though a Labour MP remains suspended for making the same comments supporting her you did is now troubled that the EHRC have begun a formal investigation?
You do realise the burden of proof and investigation needed to begin a formal Statutory Inquiry right? A level of diligence so high is required that the EHRC investigation into the BNP didnt get this far? I suspect you don’t. The EHRC reached this stage after being provided tens of thousands of pages of documentary evidence and emails. They looked at the evidence provided to them by anti-racist activists, they looked at the defence and letters submitted by Mishcon Reya (Labours lawfirm) and decided to proceed because Labour legal representation was insufficient to convince them.
As for your question. The answer is fucking simple.
I fucking hate racists. All racists. Not just racists who proclaim to be right wing. I hate people who are racists. Its very very fucking simple. Its even worse when its your former party and people you regarded as comrades turn out to be massive fucking racists. The Tories, the EDL, the Brexit Party, unlike Labours racists, those fuckers never pretended to be anti-racist, but those jewbaiting vermin in Labour right to this day are still proclaiming they are concerned about diversity and equality.
kedaha
4741
You’re lying, just as your ‘enemies’ in the alt-right are wont to. I never supported Jackie Walker, I don’t give a toss about Jackie Walker, I said your sole source was laughably biased. Indeed, I even said “I also disagree with the line anti-Semitism is no different, it is different because it can be legitimised by conflating it with anti-Zionism - but her writing is pure guff”
It’s not a ‘Statutory Inquiry’, it’s an investigation.
A level of diligence so high is required that the EHRC investigation into the BNP didnt get this far ?
Can you please provide a citation or reference for ‘the level of diligence so high’ being required? Cheers and thanks
It is amusing that you still can’t see the point. You’re dishonestly claiming an investigation being opened is the same as the investigation coming to the same final conclusion. It’s not, that’s really stupid. As stupid as your claim that a reddit poll that specifically told people not to read into it, was somehow really important, representative and valuable.
Here are the ToR for anyone curious: https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/sites/default/files/terms-of-reference-investigation-into-labour-party-28-may-2019.pdf
P.S. Seriously, cut out lying about other posters. It’s really disgusting behaviour, and hating anti-racists doesn’t excuse it.
You jumped to the defence of Jackie Walker claiming you didnt have a problem with what she said. The Labour MP who said similar is suspended, and Walker has been expelled. Incidentally it took 3 years hard work to expel her, but 3 days to expel Alexander Campbell for stating he voted LibDems in the EU elections.
The guy who threatened to kill Phillips is a loyal Corbynista, the Holocaust Deniers (plural, are fucking loads of them) are loyal Corbynistas. Campbell was Blairs advisor.
and of course the EHRC opening the formal inquiry is a huge vindication of the concerns of activists that Labour wasnt taking anti-Semitism claims seriously. Well, not just activists, sitting Labour MPs like Jess are pointing out some blatantly obvious things about the system and institutions response to Jewish issues.
To reach the point of a formal investigation, there has to be convincing evidence to backup the claims of the complainants. This is the second investigation into a British political party since equality was enshrined in law and the commission created. It’s a huge deal that they have now reached this stage, and it vindicates the hard work done to get it to this point.
If the EHRC open an investigation without any level of due diligence why have they spent months receiving submissions and information regarding Tory institutional Islamophobia and are yet to "opening a formal investigation under section 20 of the Equality Act 2006 to further examine the concerns? Its precisely because it is a Statutory Body under law that they have a high barrier to begin. It took 2 months before they began a formal investigation.
The Reddit poll was a matter of interest and thats exactly why I posted it. It absolutely remains representative of what Labour supporters think because they got wiped out in the EU elections and the figures turned out to represent the end result, because yes, Labour voters flocked to the LibDems en masse.
Can we have a thread for ranting about antisemitism in UK political parties? So that this flame war can go there?
Brexiters are stupid. End of story.
These MEPS are going to hamstring everyday people while leaving the gates wide open for themselves. The fact that people are so wrapped up in nationalism they can’t see the forest for the trees is beyond ridiculous.
Well this is interesting:
Wonder what happens if found guilty just after being made PM…
I was about to post the above, lol
It’s very much a long shot. It’s a private prosecution, and anyway, if every lying politician were prosecutable there’d be nobody left in the Commons.
