Yup, we’re now at “I’m prepared to let my own granny die in order to keep out immigrants”
These people are INSANE.
Jesus I haven’t been following this. They might actually do a no-deal Brexit? This has got to be some screwed up game of chicken, right?
The car is heading for a brick wall and nobody dares turn it because they’ll be criticized by a fanatical faction that insists on full speed ahead no matter what?
The faction that are insisting for it are lead by people who aren’t in the car.
This is pretty much where I am:
I’m not terrified by the preparations, but by the fact they’re happening so late. I’d be more sympathetic to arguments that we don’t want to waste money on things we might not need if we had in fact at least scoped this stuff out before the Article 50 negotiations, rather than scrambling to do it at the last minute for political reasons. And a lot of it, like new regulatory capacity and customs infrastructure, was going to be needed in any realistic scenario other than Remain.
I think it’s more that “no deal” is still an option at all is terrifying. I mean, we’re a rich country, and I shouldn’t have to be seriously considering stockpiling food and supplies for my family due to some kind of completely optional apocalypse. It’s all just so shockingly irresponsible.
It seems obvious to me that if May’s deal is the best they can do, then giving everyone a final “are you sure?” referendum on choosing that or remain is reasonable, easy to justify to the public, and would take “no deal” off the table.
Well, sure, but I actually think it’s less likely now than I did, say, 18 months ago. Particularly with unilateral revocation available, a truly accidental no deal seems unlikely, which wasn’t the case before, especially with the government determined to remove all possible safety valves. The terrifyingness of no deal just goes to show how foolhardy the government’s approach was, because it makes no sense as a threat in negotiations.
I mean, I agree, but as far as May’s concerned it also reduces the chances of a) her deal getting passed, and b) Brexit happening at all. Which is why the government is resisting it so hard. Her best hope is to make the choice between her deal and no deal.
I don’t think it is at all obvious that another referendum would cancel Brexit. IMO the original referendum was a mistake, and treating it as a decision was a mistake; and another referendum might just compound the mistake further. It seems to me that the pressure should be on getting Parliament to do their job — which is to make decisions on behalf of a poorly-informed electorate.
I agree, there’s a fair chance people would vote for May’s deal. In which case we deserve what we get, I guess, but we’d at least side-step the no deal emergency planning that is spooking business and straining public services.
I think getting Parliament to unilaterally cancel Brexit would require a rather higher quality of politician than we appear to have in the current cohort, both in terms of having the backbone to go through with it, and somehow convincing the 52% not to revolt. And I worry that this course of action would create an opportunity for far-right groups to increase in popularity amongst people feeling betrayed.
Representative and direct democracy just don’t mix, and I agree the original referendum was a mistake. But I think a second referendum is still the least worst way out of the mess it created.
Part of me.is morbidly curious to see what would happen.
And to see the twisting and avoidance of responsibility and blaming that will happen.
I’m not a rich person but I dont have any dependents and I am in good health and my Plan B (live and work in Spain) is already in place so I can afford a certain level of smugness when the people who voted leave end up suffering.
Also, maybe a minor technicality but it was 52 % of the people who voted, not including the substantial number who were disenfranchised and stood to be the most affected by Nympton such vote (long term British expats in Europe ) and various who didn’t vote.
I believe it is more like 30% of the population that voted leave.
Then split that amongst the various clans of leavers and honestly, I’m not sure how many would honestly choose no deal over retract A50.
And of those that would, if I were a politician I’d be willing to fall on my sword for this.
Then again, that’s probably why I’m not a politician, not slimy enough in the first place.
I’ve only met about 4 MPs and they were slimy.
There is yet another emergency debate happening, this time on ‘no deal preparations’.
It seems perpetually insane to me that a government can bring a country so close to serious self-harm, even spend money mitigating their own self-made risk, and then threaten to go over the brink unless their policy to voted for.
Look, I think (and certainly hope) that with the current Spanish government you would be fine anyway, but in case of a no-deal Brexit, unless you have citizenship (I don’t remember), it’s not 100% certain British expats could stay and work. It would depend on a national decision, and at the very least there would be the need to apply for a work visa, that could or could not be granted. I’ve know Americans having to work illegally here due to visa difficulties. It would probably also be related to reciprocity on the UK part (and that’s more in question)
Again, I think there’s no real reason to be concerned (even if no deal, the current government is very soft on immigration and humanitarian), but your situation is not certainly risk free. Unless you have citizenship, of course.
As an American who would have given a lot for the right to live and work freely in Europe, this is the part of Brexit that I really can’t grasp: Why anyone would deliberately give up that right. For the young people of Britain especially, it will tremendously impact their opportunities in the future.
Bear in mind that Brits’ foreign language proficiency is generally terrible, so for a lot of people they probably don’t even think of it as a possibility. Also, remember the massive age differential in the Brexit vote. Young people overwhelmingly voted Remain.
So much this. We need a passport now to visit flippin’ Canada.
It’s not as if we are governed by jingoistic, colonialist throwbacks who will be making very loud warlike statements about Gibraltar or anything is it.
Because:
Freeeeeeedddddooooooooooooooom!
Please…that’s old news and no-one cares about Howard the Vampire.
At the very least you risk losing the ability to freely move to other EU countries, which, if you can stay in Spain and are good there, might not be much of an issue.
That was just the jingoistic warlike comment about Gibraltar from the gammons at the top of google, now what’s the bet i could dig out some more?
We’ve already had sitting Tory MPs making veiled snark about famine to the Irish in the last few months. Nothing is beneath these scum.