Brexit, aka, the UK Shoots Itself


#2530

I don’t think it is at all obvious that another referendum would cancel Brexit. IMO the original referendum was a mistake, and treating it as a decision was a mistake; and another referendum might just compound the mistake further. It seems to me that the pressure should be on getting Parliament to do their job — which is to make decisions on behalf of a poorly-informed electorate.


#2531

I agree, there’s a fair chance people would vote for May’s deal. In which case we deserve what we get, I guess, but we’d at least side-step the no deal emergency planning that is spooking business and straining public services.

I think getting Parliament to unilaterally cancel Brexit would require a rather higher quality of politician than we appear to have in the current cohort, both in terms of having the backbone to go through with it, and somehow convincing the 52% not to revolt. And I worry that this course of action would create an opportunity for far-right groups to increase in popularity amongst people feeling betrayed.

Representative and direct democracy just don’t mix, and I agree the original referendum was a mistake. But I think a second referendum is still the least worst way out of the mess it created.


#2532

Part of me.is morbidly curious to see what would happen.

And to see the twisting and avoidance of responsibility and blaming that will happen.

I’m not a rich person but I dont have any dependents and I am in good health and my Plan B (live and work in Spain) is already in place so I can afford a certain level of smugness when the people who voted leave end up suffering.

Also, maybe a minor technicality but it was 52 % of the people who voted, not including the substantial number who were disenfranchised and stood to be the most affected by Nympton such vote (long term British expats in Europe ) and various who didn’t vote.

I believe it is more like 30% of the population that voted leave.

Then split that amongst the various clans of leavers and honestly, I’m not sure how many would honestly choose no deal over retract A50.

And of those that would, if I were a politician I’d be willing to fall on my sword for this.

Then again, that’s probably why I’m not a politician, not slimy enough in the first place.

I’ve only met about 4 MPs and they were slimy.


#2533

There is yet another emergency debate happening, this time on ‘no deal preparations’.

It seems perpetually insane to me that a government can bring a country so close to serious self-harm, even spend money mitigating their own self-made risk, and then threaten to go over the brink unless their policy to voted for.


#2534

Look, I think (and certainly hope) that with the current Spanish government you would be fine anyway, but in case of a no-deal Brexit, unless you have citizenship (I don’t remember), it’s not 100% certain British expats could stay and work. It would depend on a national decision, and at the very least there would be the need to apply for a work visa, that could or could not be granted. I’ve know Americans having to work illegally here due to visa difficulties. It would probably also be related to reciprocity on the UK part (and that’s more in question)

Again, I think there’s no real reason to be concerned (even if no deal, the current government is very soft on immigration and humanitarian), but your situation is not certainly risk free. Unless you have citizenship, of course.


#2535

As an American who would have given a lot for the right to live and work freely in Europe, this is the part of Brexit that I really can’t grasp: Why anyone would deliberately give up that right. For the young people of Britain especially, it will tremendously impact their opportunities in the future.


#2536

Bear in mind that Brits’ foreign language proficiency is generally terrible, so for a lot of people they probably don’t even think of it as a possibility. Also, remember the massive age differential in the Brexit vote. Young people overwhelmingly voted Remain.


#2537

So much this. We need a passport now to visit flippin’ Canada.


#2538

It’s not as if we are governed by jingoistic, colonialist throwbacks who will be making very loud warlike statements about Gibraltar or anything is it.


#2539

Because:

Freeeeeeedddddooooooooooooooom!


#2540

Please…that’s old news and no-one cares about Howard the Vampire.


#2541

At the very least you risk losing the ability to freely move to other EU countries, which, if you can stay in Spain and are good there, might not be much of an issue.


#2542

That was just the jingoistic warlike comment about Gibraltar from the gammons at the top of google, now what’s the bet i could dig out some more?

We’ve already had sitting Tory MPs making veiled snark about famine to the Irish in the last few months. Nothing is beneath these scum.


#2543

Yup. I have family members who voted Brexit but also now are complaining about their right of residency in the EU being taken away.

Yes you read that right.

My people are Hobbits.


#2544

ProudFEET!


#2545

Perfect! :)


#2546

Almost funny :(


#2547

This arrangement seems so very Brexit.


#2548

I actually think the response to this is a bit overdone. It would be one thing if this were the main contract/route, but it’s not. It’s about reviving a currently not–in-use route, and the reason the company owns no ships and has never run a Channel service before is that it was set up specifically to revive the Ramsgate-Ostend route, separately from Brexit, a few years ago, and is still gearing up to operate it. If, as a government, you’re going to revive the route because of Brexit, it probably makes sense, ceteris paribus, to give the contract to the company that has done the preparatory work and got permissions and so on rather than have someone else have to got through that again, especially given the short notice.


#2549

The company is owned by a bunch of establishment types including those sitting in the House of Lords. This is a corrupt wealth transfer from public to private.