Building a deck of deckbuilders

Surprisingly, only 2 game (Ratropolis and Slay) took a really long time but I enjoy them enough to not really care.

The rest I finished in 20-40 hours on average with games like Iris and Banner taking much less time (<20 hours).

Excellent - Tainted Grail, One Step From Eden, Trials of fire
Great - Slay the Spire, Monster slayers, Ratropolis, Dark Mist, Deep Sky Derelict, Erannorth Reborn
Good - Neoverse, Iris, Fate Hunter, Banner of Ruin, Dicey Dungeons
Not so good - Dungeon Top, Griftlands (I tried for 100% but I fell asleep…)

Of the above, my 3 excellent games are the only ones I still have installed. Beating Trials of Fire on Cataclysm 10 and One Step on 14 was very satisfying.

Likewise I have 2 kids, family commitments, FT job, and other hobbies (woodworking, gardening, Spreadsheets) so I have to be careful with the games I play. I was more worried about Monster Train being too addicting and eat up my time.

This was the intention of my warning. I played quite a lot of Monster Train this last weekend. It ended up creating a time vortex that shrunk my weekend to a perceived 35 seconds. Nothing that was supposed to get done, actually got done. Monster Train us up there with Monster Slayers as far as innocently tricking me into a click or two that then becomes thousands and a long since set sun.

So again, take it as encouragement or a warning.

I really liked Nowhere Prophet, which is on Game Pass. The mechanic of the cards getting wounded, which made them more powerful but also if they got killed again they were removed from your deck, was an interesting bit of tension.

Funny you mention this game.

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I was playing this game off and on for the last 2 years or so. Finally got everything today.

I have to say though. I really hate this game. It’s one of the most frustrating roguelike deck builders I ever played.

It’s always fascinating to me the people who hate-plays videogames :P

Yeah lol. I thought it was something I did not get so I kept on trying to like it off and on for 2 years.

It is interesting, but that tension is a big part of why I bought this game ages ago but barely played it. Not a knock on the game at all, but o tend to not play games that make me stressed (e.g. darkest dungeon)

I started the game…
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Also this game just left early access. It’s a murder mystery deckbuilder. It also have tactical combat! @Lykurgos buy it and tell me how the game is :P

hehe, you know, I am pretty sure we are genetically identical twins, separated at birth and placed with different foster families sworn to absolute secrecy, but we are now reuniting through discovering an identical love and addiction to tactical combat deckbuilders :-P

As for the suggestion, sure, of course, I do not really have a choice!

I am playing and after about an hour . . . it is like nothing I have ever played! So far it kinda feels a bit like the investigation and exploration part of Ultima 7 with a boons / banes character development model, tile-based combat fought with uncontrolled AI allies, but in a good way, a bit of economy, a bit of time management and boom nope, cannot parse it yet, too much! Will keep playing!

One thing does desperately need change. The turn based tactical grid combat looks interesting. It uses a time based system to organise ‘turns’, so if you do less, your next turn arrives earlier. Problem is, when the allies and opponents act all the outcomes play out without pauses to let you observe them, so it is really tricky to make sense of what is happening. Once it is back to your turn though you can view enemy and ally intentions for their next turn together with any status effects, so it is a bother, rather than critical.

Okay, so about The Magister . . .

It is rather special, rather unique, and therefore not so simple to describe. Recap that it is a murder mystery and you are a Magister with 15 days to solve a murder.

It has point and click adventure elements, perhaps most similar to games like Secret of Monkey Island, Sam & Max, Kings Quest etc. This is the way by which you move around the world, talk to characters, and try and develop clues and knowledge.

Characters you talk to have a simple 3 star relationship to you and typically you need to reach 3 stars to get the most from them, such as a clue or key information. You get to 3 in various ways, missions with combat, finding an item they want, selling or buying stuff from them.

As you go about tasks and missions, there are two forms of combat, mental and physical. The mental combat - Tactical Diplomacy - is thematically similar to that in Griftlands whilst having some mechanics similar to those in Star Realms… You are trying to reduce ‘rage’ via empathy. You do so by playing a card game where you make choices about which additional cards to buy from an ever-refreshing set of 3, with these cards costing empathy, which is the same resource you use to reduce rage, and all within a time-limit. So you have this challenging trade off between growing your economy and actually exploiting what you have to try and reach the goal line. It seems to work well.

The physical combat is played out turn-based, but with the space between turns determined by how many seconds of action your turn takes up. It is something comparable to the combat seen in the Banner Saga. Each turn you get 4 cards, with potential for extra draw, and you can play all or none. You can also play cards for their direct effect or discard them for other effects. It seems to add up to a highly variable, significantly engaging and thoughtful combat. Definitely not Trials of Fire clever, but highly credible. Whilst you control just your own character most or all fights are conducted with allies. In contrast to games where allies are just a pain in the ass to try and save or workaround, it really seems to work here particularly because there is nothing critical tied to the outcome for those allies, and both allies and enemies rout and run once they reach low health.

Then there are the RPG elements. You gain XP, you level up, and doing so enables you to choose a new skill from three groups of 9 themed around brawn, intellect and guile. This after you start out by choosing an archetype combining some significant bonuses together with a significant weakness, such as alcoholic and insomniac.

The murder mystery is procedural, and it does look like several replays may be worth enjoying. I am loving it. It seems to be from the same team or developer that made Monster Slayers, the pre-Slay the Spire Slay the Spire-like, and I would rate it as equal in appeal and quality.

So there ya go @Hereafter and also, @Mysterio is playing this, so what does he think? :-)

You summed it up nicely. It’s a game I knew I’d buy Day 1 after participating in the beta and then playing the recently released The First Two Days (play the first two days for free):

So it’s a thumbs up for me!

Also, if someone exists who doesn’t own Nerdook’s previous game (Monster Slayers), yet, PM me for a Steam key, which I’ve had since the beta (last Sept.).

Is the diplomacy less tedious than griftlands? I find that one such a chore that I don’t bother. I Should definitely try the demo.

You might cross post that in the magister thread

Thanks for the discussion on The Magister. I had really enjoyed Monster Slayers yet missed the developers had a new game out. This sounds great. Time to acquire.

Warning. Alert. Danger.

Just seeing the same intro logo and hearing the sounds, and seeing the same shape save buttons as from Monster Slayers invoked strong nostalgia and prompted me to reinstall. I then found myself picking up part way through a run with a Frost Dragon. However . . . time is not so kind. Feels to me now like a big negative for Monster Slayers relative to a lot of successor roguelike deckbuilding card-battlers is that on many turns there are no decisions to take. You just play all the cards you have. This can change a bit, and sometimes the order matters, but a big chunk of the gameplay does feel old and missing something now

I also played a ton of Monster Slayers. I missed that it was the same people. Aside from the key offered above, it is on sale for $2.24 on Steam.

Monster Slayer actually got me into the genre. It was also the first game I 100% in achievements. I’m afraid to retry it now after what Lykurgos said lol.

Speaking of achievements. I got 100% on Monster Train.
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Definitely the best deck builder out there. Monster Train will probably stay on my hard drive for the foreseeable future.

One thing I noticed is the average run in MT. It’s less than 1 hour. Lots of the new games in the genre seems to think that longer runs are better. I really don’t. 2+ hours for a run is far too long. I checked my lists and all the games in this genre that I really like are the short ones.

hehe, I definitely use way more than 1 hour to optimize my morsel armies in Monster Train. I am with you regarding the desired run-duration though and especially if a game offers daily or weekly challenges as part of longer-term replay appeal. Longer durations will pretty much exclude me right off from any daily challenge.

For example, there is a promising looking deckbuilding roguelike for which I have played the demo. Across the Obelisk, but runs are reported to take 4+ hours. That scares me off . . . albeit if those extra hours somehow deepen the experience rather than turning into a slog, I could go for it

Agreed on run length, especially since I’m a slow player. Definitely one of the things that drew me to monster train.

Monster train is half price on steam