1966

I’m guessing because both are or have been claimed as victims of cancel culture.

Andy appears to have a narrow definition of cancel culture that, while frankly one of the most detailed and somewhat sensible I’ve seen offered, is at odds with a large number of the claimed victims of cancel culture like Rowling or Chapelle, etc.

Hence the counterproductive pointlessness of the term.

1967

Because he wants to act like the definition of “cancel culture” is confusing by applying it to anything and everything, and then acting confused afterwards.

1970

There are plenty of articles and videos delineating the nuances between people positively calling out bad behavior (i.e. not cancel culture) and bad-faith actors piling on and causing really damage (i.e. actual cancel culture). And as you point out, I’ve already explained what I feel the distinction is. Bringing up misuse of the term is just another way to derail the conversation.

1971

I’ve expressed that I think your definition is an actually detailed and sensible one. You should recognize when someone is agreeing with you (at least in part). If we could make your definition the common standard definition that people used I’d be all for it and wouldn’t think “Cancel Culture” is the useless thought terminating cliché it is in common parlance.

1972

It’s not a personal attack at all; it’s a criticism of your argument. You argue that Rowling and Gunn are both “cancel culture” because the term is so confusing; people explain the differences; then when someone asks why you equate them, you say “because the term is so confusing.” It’s a circular argument.

1973

Yes, I recognize that you agreed with me (at least in part), and thank you for acknowledging that. I just don’t know why we have to discuss the “common parlance” instead of the definition that we’ve both agreed is more sensible.

1975

Okay, go ahead. I and others have been totally open to discussing online harassment of the specific nature you describe, which you admit is not what is usually meant by cancel culture when most people use it. The obsession with labeling thing cancel culture is not coming from those who consider it a useless term.

1977

Dude, you just said you didn’t even know what your position was anymore.

1978

I don’t know what position of yours you think I made up. This meta-discussion makes things even more confusing.

When you claimed that Rowling and Gunn were equivalent, you were specifically talking about my definition of the term (emphasis mine):

Again, you are talking about my usage of the term. As I said before:

1979

Sorry, I was paraphrasing, not trying to pass that off as a direct quote.

1981

Some people use the term “cancel culture” in a way that seems accurate; other people use the term (often talking about themselves) as a way to excuse being validly called out for their positions. But I think it makes more sense to settle on a definition that seems correct, instead of ignoring the term completely just because some people use it wrong.

1982

Or you could stop obsessing on the term and talk about the things you seem to be claiming we’re preventing you from talking about.

If we must have a universally acceptable term for online harassment, online harassment seems like a good term. Maybe start a tread “How to combat online harassment” free from the baggage of this term and the burden of trying to redefine it.

1983

First of all, the thread is called “Cancel Culture”, so defining the term accurately should be given some consideration. And I think that “cancel culture” covers more than just online harassment; it’s online harassment plus bad faith plus dogpiling plus amplification plus refusal to acknowledge change…plus the culture that thinks these things are normal and acceptable.

1985

He said he couldn’t remember his position. ;)

1986

Wasn’t one of the initial issues a tweet using the semi-common phrase “if you squint” to compare two movies and people taking it in bad faith as a racist attack on Asians?

1987

Can we cancel this thread? It seems to have gotten even worse.

1988

Don’t enter this thread without a thesaurus, a dictionary and a willingness to go on forever. :)

1989

Nice try, but there were plenty of people who dogpiled on literally saying, “I’ve never liked Lindsay Ellis, so I’m glad she’s finally being canceled!” And that doesn’t even count the countless people who hadn’t seen either Raya or Avatar (or both) and thus complained about her comparison on the surface level without knowing the actual context.

Yes, that too.

1990

So regardless of the common or desired definition of the increasingly proven to be useless and distracting term “Cancel Culture” in regard to online harassment in general or the specific definition given I’ll again return to the question posed.

1991

It’s not useless or distracting to specify what we’re talking about before talking about it.

I think the goal is to define the term so it’s specific and not a “nebulous category of people”.