MLK didn’t succeed because of peace, he succeeded because America saw the threat of not changing, and fear of communism infiltrating the black community.
You don’t get change unless you convince the powerful that not changing is a threat. It doesn’t have to be a violent threat, but a threat to the system is needed.
Two things…
In the Tulsa slaying the attorney is saying Shelby (shooting officer, a woman btw) feared he had a gun in his pocket which he kept touching… despite visual evidence to the contrary showing the main with arms raised over his head standing next to his vehicle?
and in my earlier remark I specified ‘able-bodied’ black men but the next killing in Charlotte put lie to that. Fucking hell.
The Charlotte police are saying their guy had a gun vs. the family saying he had a book. Hopefully there’s video to prove which side is correct. What a mess…
Given the brazen, and provably false, claims from police just this week, I know which one I’m more inclined to believe. Without video I must assume that the Charlotte police are just trying to cover their asses.
The thing that was so weird about the tulsa shooting, was how the guy in the chopper is like, “That guy looks like a bad dude!” While he was doing literally nothing threatening at all. He was big and black, and that’s literally all.
Then there was some guy on CNN defending it, and he said the same thing, “That guy looked like a bad dude!” And another person on the panel was like, “WTF? What about him makes you think he’s a bad dude? What exactly?” and he’s just like, “Just looking at him. The same thing that made the guy in the chopper think he was a bad dude!”
So, basically, the fact that he’s a big black guy. The guy is openly demonstrating prejudice, without realizing it. On live TV. Nuts.
And folks know I’m not anti-cops. Hell, back in this very thread I’ve given cops every reasonable benefit of the doubt. But there comes a point where it is no longer reasonable.
and given McCrory’s new stupid law of the week, unless I see proof otherwise, I’ll assume the Charlotte PD is lying.
Yep, pretty much this. And if the cops are, I sure as hell hope a video pops up to prove it or it’ll just be the cops’words against theirs.
Yes, exactly. I mean what is that law other than a big middle finger to everyone wanting transparency? What did he think the effects would be? If the footage is so damning as to incite civil unrest then don’t do things that are so damning! The answer isn’t to hide the video and hope it goes away. Because any time departments refuse to release footage Occam’s Razor demands we must interpret that as a tacit admission that they were wrong, and now someone is dead because of their fuck up.
Because if the video exonerates police action you can be damned sure that footage gets out.
Who wants to bet that he was holding a book with a picture of a gun on its cover?
I’m willing to cut the chopper pilot a little bit of slack - by “Bad Dude”, I think he probably meant it as “large and imposing” primarily, and “black” secondarily. I’m willing to bet that if I were pulled over, given my 6’6" frame and halfway athletic frame, I’d probably be labeled a “Bad Dude” too. I’d kind of be disappointed if I weren’t.
The CNN guy, I give less slack to.
My wife and I were talking about this on our way to a school event last night. I know I’m preaching to the choir here, but I absolutely think that the standard for drawing a firearm for police is far, far too low, much less discharging a weapon.
I know that 99% of all cops and a goodly proportion of this board will disagree with me, but I’d go so far as to require a suspect to fire first before a cop is allowed to use lethal force. Yes, it’s a dangerous job (#15 in the US, behind lawn-care workers, according to Time), and yes, they interact with “Bad Dudes” on a regular basis, but you know what? I no longer view that as a good excuse when so many unarmed civilians and especially children are being killed in the name of “officer safety”. No one is being drafted into the police force.
Given the recent killings, and the fact that the national police union just endorsed Trump, I don’t honestly give a fuck what their opinion is on usage of weapons.
That said while I think your standard may be a bit too strict, it is easy to devise situations where that would be bad, it is not a bad place to start discussion. There should be a strong justification for use of force, rather than strong proof the use was unwarranted. Flip the burden of proof. If the use of lethal force occurs then there must be video evidence or termination. That video evidence should be part of an independent investigation.
turn off your body cam and kill someone and no other video available? Then there needs to be more than other cops word just to back you up.
Of course. It’s a one-sentence statement of policy, so there will always be valid exceptions. If there is a report of shot-fired, I’d expect the cops to come in primed. If the suspect is already known to be violent, or if there are innocents in imminent danger etc., etc.
It’s these one-off confrontations with theoretically innocent-until-proven-guilty individuals that get my ire up. Even Tamir Rice, where the cops were alerted to a “guy with a gun” should have required some unambiguously violent action before the cops took action. “I thought he was going for his gun” should not be a valid excuse.
Maybe I’m a callous ass playing “what if” games with other people’s mothers and fathers, but I think I’m OK with a few more police officers being wounded or dying each year if it saves an equal or greater number of innocent civilian lives. I’d also be willing to pay more in taxes to give the ones that feel that the new rules are too strict the option to retire early and/or to up the salaries of the ones who choose to stay on the force.
Crutcher video released: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/20/us/video-released-in-terence-crutchers-killing-by-tulsa-police.html?_r=0 (Tulsa 9/16 shooting, doesn’t autoplay)
Straight up murder.
Has it been confirmed that his car broke down? Do the police admit that was the scenario?
Neither the dash cam or the helicopter video looks good for the shooting officer, I think. Terrence Crutcher does seem to lean on his truck, and at least one arm did move from the up position to either down or towards the vehicle window, but nothing I saw warranted shooting.
It should also be completely damning that only one officer fired. Why weren’t the others threatened??
Well, another office did fire a taser at the same time as the gun, noting that both officers probably saw something that made them pull the trigger.
But, c’mon. Cops are far too trigger happy.
I mean, the videos aren’t great, but nothing in either video shows a reason to even fire the taser, but I’ll be happy if we can just get cops to stop killing people for the smallest infractions. Baby steps, you know?
Different people can come to different conclusions, both of which are reasonable.