Canuck
6194
What in the hell is he talking about?
Timex
6195
Trump cultists are so awful.
Jesus, if I got a letter like that from my CEO…
Tim_N
6197
It’s starting to look like our options are:
i) worldwide depression (alot of people dying), closed borders, governments controlling our everyday lives, ‘suspension’ of democracy, nationalism thriving for at least the next decade.
ii) alot of people dying
Hal9000
6198
What I think the USA is like right now from reading the news.
Except for Florida, which is apparently the world’s largest beach orgy.
Going for takeout last night and this morning I saw a few things of interest.
A group of skaters (adults, as most are in SF) videoing themselves doing stunts on Haight Street, grinding on the bus stop seats and totally ignoring pedestrians and cars.
One dog walker last night and one today gave us dirty looks when we stopped rather than try to squeeze past when they let their dogs block the sidewalks. They seemed insulted by the idea that we should seek social distancing from them…And from their dogs.
A friend of the chick’s reports being yelled at for trying to maintain distancing from someone on the sidewalk. “Are you SAYING I’m INFECTED???”
A bicyclist pulled off the Wiggle (a marked bicycle route) onto the sidewalk in front of us, pulled out his phone, and began reading. It was a wide sidewalk, easily 10 feet, but he put his bike crosswise right in the center and ignored us. We stepped into the street laughing a little, because we knew he’d done it on purpose. SF is full of people who do little crazy provocations, even now, I guess.
NO bums. None. That is very very very unusual.
Scrax
6200
That’s good to hear. My 15 year old rescue puggle has apparently been testing me every night for COVID-19
my pharmacy run this afternoon
KevinC
6203
Or you could understand sometimes people just need to vent and let the occasional “I can’t believe my neighbor/friend/colleague/family member did this” post slide. :) People not social distancing are putting people in harm’s way, so it’s similar to watching someone get being the wheel drunk. It can induce some anger and frustration when you see it happening.
Yes, as per the other CV thread about emotional toll, we all gotta accept that people are just gonna need to vent once in a while. Qt3 is as good a place as any.
KevinC
6205
So… Michigan just exempted places of worship from the 50-person ban. Why in Earth would they do such a thing?
Scuzz
6206
Maybe I hope we never do.
Tim_N
6207
Just as a respectful aside, if you are standing close to some people who has voluntarily come within your orbit, and you are all adults, then I don’t see how it akin to putting people in harm’s away or getting behind the wheel drunk. You’re all accepting added risk to the interaction.
I do understand the argument that being sloppy with your own health increases the risk you’ll take away hospital resources that an older person may end up needing through no fault of their own.
pyrhic
6208
27k Confirmed in the US, 12k in NY alone. US surpasses China(81k) for the number one spot…Tuesday? Hmmm…maybe not that quick, i don’t know if we’re that efficient with testing yet…
Oh, and i see Greenland and Madagascar both have it now, so that makes…Antarctica the only exception now i think…
KevinC
6209
Because it doesn’t stop with them! Infected people go on to infect others, often before they’re symptomatic. They decide to throw caution to the wind, then they go to a grocery store or elsewhere and spread the virus there. Some poor vulnerable person is at the store and gets it from them.
It’s similar to someone drunk driving because it’s not just THEIR life on the line, it’s also the innocents they run into.
A doctor friend of mine just posted this and I thought it was compelling.
From an epidemiologist:
As an infectious disease epidemiologist at this point I feel morally obligated to provide some information on what we are seeing from a transmission dynamic perspective and how they apply to the social distancing measures. Specifically, I want to make two aspects of these measures very clear and unambiguous.
First, we are in the very infancy of this epidemic’s trajectory. That means even with these measures we will see cases and deaths continue to rise globally, nationally, and in our own communities in the coming weeks. Our hospitals will be overwhelmed, and people will die that didn’t have to. This may lead some people to think that the social distancing measures are not working. They are. They may feel futile. They aren’t. You will feel discouraged. You should. This is normal in chaos. This enemy that we are facing is very good at what it does; we are not failing. We need everyone to hold the line as the epidemic inevitably gets worse. This is not my opinion; this is the unforgiving math of epidemics for which I and my colleagues have dedicated our lives to understanding with great nuance, and this disease is no exception. We know what will happen; I want to help the community brace for this impact. Stay strong and with solidarity knowing with absolute certainty that what you are doing is saving lives, even as people begin getting sick and dying around you. You may feel like giving in. Don’t.
Second, although social distancing measures have been (at least temporarily) well-received, there is an obvious-but-overlooked phenomenon when considering groups (i.e. families) in transmission dynamics. While social distancing decreases contact with members of society, it of course increases your contacts with group (i.e. family) members. This small and obvious fact has surprisingly profound implications on disease transmission dynamics. Study after study demonstrates that even if there is only a little bit of connection between groups (i.e. social dinners, playdates/playgrounds, etc.), the epidemic trajectory isn’t much different than if there was no measure in place. The same underlying fundamentals of disease transmission apply, and the result is that the community is left with all of the social and economic disruption but very little public health benefit. You should perceive your entire family to function as a single individual unit; if one person puts themselves at risk, everyone in the unit is at risk. Seemingly small social chains get large and complex with alarming speed. If your son visits his girlfriend, and you later sneak over for coffee with a neighbor, your neighbor is now connected to the infected office worker that your son’s girlfriend’s mother shook hands with. This sounds silly, it’s not. This is not a joke or a hypothetical. We as epidemiologists see it borne out in the data time and time again and no one listens. Conversely, any break in that chain breaks disease transmission along that chain.
In contrast to hand-washing and other personal measures, social distancing measures are not about individuals, they are about societies working in unison. These measures also take a long time to see the results. It is hard (even for me) to conceptualize how ‘one quick little get together’ can undermine the entire framework of a public health intervention, but it does. I promise you it does. I promise. I promise. I promise. You can’t cheat it. People are already itching to cheat on the social distancing precautions just a “little”- a playdate, a haircut, or picking up a needless item at the store, etc. From a transmission dynamics standpoint, this very quickly recreates a highly connected social network that undermines all of the work the community has done so far.
Until we get a viable vaccine this unprecedented outbreak will not be overcome in grand, sweeping gesture, rather only by the collection of individual choices our community makes in the coming months. This virus is unforgiving to unwise choices. My goal in writing this is to prevent communities from getting ‘sucker-punched’ by what the epidemiological community knows will happen in the coming weeks. It will be easy to be drawn to the idea that what we are doing isn’t working and become paralyzed by fear, or to ‘cheat’ a little bit in the coming weeks. By knowing what to expect, and knowing the importance of maintaining these measures, my hope is to encourage continued community spirit, strategizing, and action to persevere in this time of uncertainty.
jpinard
6211
No. There’s a ton of new patients this week all over the nation on ventilators, UofM went from 0-40 in a couple days this week. 25-30% of vented patients won’t make it. Many hospitals are just nearing capacity and some have hit max capacity and can’t take any more. I can’t see how those numbers will go down with way more people on ventilators than before.
Edit
Sorry didn’t see the other posts.
