I agree patience has a lot to do with it. I hesitate to judge whether an impatient gamer is “doing wrong” as opposed to poor game design.
In any case, the game is tough for explorers like myself because checking out that next area is a big part of the fun. I get impatient because I’m ready to move on. I have to reason with myself that it’s better to take it slow. The worst is when that fails multiple times due to poor execution with the controller. Then I usually break down and try to brute force it again. Fortunately there were long stretches between difficulty spikes.
For example, ElGuapo should have a nice stretch after he beats this boss.
ElGuapo
1942
Well thank God for that. I’ve fought that son of a bitch on the castle wall too many times.
Take the combat of this and add the open world of Minecraft… drool.
I wrote a very short general boss fight guide that should help minimize repetition for new players. Search for it in the DS PC thread.
IMO, games requiring patience is not a matter of bad or good design, it’s just the kind of game it is. Similar to simulators, for example, “it’s so slow” is a common complaint from people trying Arma games for the first time. For the same reason I won’t play any of the MS Flight Simulator games - they are just too slow for me, not enough is going on at any given time. I am sure, they are very good and rewarding games for people who enjoy them but they are not for everyone. Impatient players in these games are simply “doing it wrong”.
So perhaps, Dark Souls is a tomb raider simulator. :)
The cool thing about DS (as opposed to “real” simulators) is that playing slowly and methodically is a “safe” way to play it but not the only one. Once one gets familiar with the game and the area, it’s A LOT of fun to go through an area quickly and recklessly. You get a very nice adrenaline jolt and, when you get through some zone in this manner, you get a very nice feeling of achievement and satisfaction. :)
Where’s that My Little Pony NopeNopeNope gif when you need it?
The level design is a major part of what makes these games good. The balance of dread with excitement, the way (mentioned up thread) that the game gives you environmental clues without making anything explicit, etc.
Also, at the beginning it’s hard to appreciate, but the entire world is one huge connected environment, with very little cheating of distances, etc. The combat is fun, but the level design is the real star of the show.
Started this up last night. I had played it when it originally came out, but I don’t think I made it too far. The game looks great with the patch. Taurus Demon was a piece of cake this time around. I don’t think the next boss will go as smoothly though.
Just another post to implore you to stick with it. I just finished up my second run through with a sorcerer a few weeks ago, and I’ve got a knight in the mid 40s for my third. If anyone is playing on PC and needs assistance I’d be glad to help. Friend me up on Steam or Live: Glycerine74
*** Possible Spoiler ***
For the Taurus demon you can grab the black firebombs in the Undead Burg and use them to make the fight a bit easier. Take out the two archers first, run up until the demon drops onto the bridge, get close enough to toss a firebomb at him, roll back away quickly to dodge whatever attack he throws, rinse and repeat until the bombs are gone. Run back to the ladder and do a plunge attack when he’s right below you. (Drop off, hit normal attack button on the way down.) If he’s not already dead he should be very close, swing around behind and literally beat his ass. It pays to stay as close as you can, even step between his legs if you can. Most of his attacks will miss you completely. Also, keep your shield up at all times unless you are attacking or regenerating stamina.
Is parry as worthless as I think it is or is it worth learning? I can never get the timing right.
It’s high risk / high reward, there are some enemies that it basically trivializes if you can get the timing right, but it definitely isn’t ever necessary.
I skipped it for most of the game. Eventually I became overpowered so I used it a bit to challenge myself or kill enemies quickly.
There’s a tutorial video. I think the key breakthrough for me was parrying the tip of the weapon. I got pretty reliable with it then.
This game didn’t really grab me the first time even though I adored Demon’s Souls. It’s got its hooks in me now though. I put the smackdown on the Capra demon which felt great since I never got passed him when I first played the game. I didn’t even think I was supposed to fight him at that time back then. He seemed so insurmountable. Didn’t take too many tries to best him tonight. Screw those Bell Gargoyles though.
Couple questions:
- For awhile I was having Estus flasks just appear randomly. Don’t think that ever happened the first time I played this. What’s up with that?
- Twice I have seen a white ring shape on the ground. What the heck is that? When the second one appeared I saw another ring overlapping my heal spell.
Your estus counter increases when someone nearby kindles a bonfire. It’s a nice touch, I still smile when it happens, just as I smile when I hear a bell ring.
I don’t really want to get into a “‘this game is so cheap’ ‘no you’re just bad’” fight, but I didn’t die to that barrel the first time I played through that area. That might be because I played Demon’s Souls and I knew to be aware of my surroundings. It’s not no warning. I also killed the Tarsus demon on my first go. And the law firm for that matter. I died loads of times in some other areas, though. It’s quite possible to learn these fights as you’re in them, without having to die to learn. Mostly, you will learn through dying, as we all did, but those deaths are avoidable in principle. I strongly suspect that the people who feel the game is cheap, or that they died unavoidably (except for that one time, you know the one) are just used to modern games that lead you by the hand, and do all they can to ensure you succeed. As others have said, the defining characteristic of the souls games is that they do not care if you win, they don’t care if you fail, they just are.
And on that note, after all the stories and giving the game another try, it turned out to be just too hard for me. Tried for 4 days to get past that one section. Never did.
I think this might be a defining moment in gaming for me. I’ve realized that some game design choices just aren’t for me.
That’s fine. I strongly suspect Souls veterans have lost some perspective of what it’s like to play these games the first time, especially for those of us who haven’t played a game like this since the 1980s. They are good at reflecting on the experience as a whole but poor at empathizing with those who haven’t reached the enlightened state that comes from finishing the game at least once. I think sailing through the frustrating parts means you’re even less able to help.
Sorry you bounced off it. The idea is to post to the Dark Souls thread and ask for help. If you already sent it back, then never mind…
This is also an online feature, similar to the other people’s fire kindling giving you a flask. I forgot what it’s called though. When someone in their game uses a miracle spell, in your game you might see a white ring in that spot. If you scroll through your miracles, you might see one marked with a similar white circle (if you have equipped the miracle that person used). If you cast that miracle it will receive some bonus to its power.
It’s mostly inconsequential feature, the bonus is not that great and you see these circles pretty rarely but it’s a cool feature that, similar to the bell ringing, always makes me smile too.
BTW, always kindle fires, especially in the beginning of the game, where pretty much all fires are going to be used multiple times and most of them are near some bosses. Humanity is easy to come by and additional flasks make exploration more enjoyable as you have more margin for error. Also use those “Soul of …” items to get souls when you are a bit short. There are TONS of those souls and yet I always end up saving them for later and having dozens of each type unused.
I never noticed bells ringing. I assume you can hear it when others ring them?
I always thought that white ring was a graphics glitch, oops.
On the other hand, I don’t think its controversial to say that these games just aren’t for everyone. It’s perfectly okay not to like them.
Yep. We even tested them in coop, it’s such a cool feature. I am surprised you never noticed it.
I always thought that white ring was a graphics glitch, oops.
Hehe, me too, until I read about it somewhere.
Wade42
1959
I agree but would elaborate: use these if you need a little extra to buy something or level up, but don’t just use them indiscriminately. Reason: You don’t lose ‘Soul of…’ items when you die.
Also note that this does not apply other soul items, like ‘Firekeeper’s Soul’… these usually have better alternate uses.
Especially the souls you get from bosses, you can craft some cool equipment from those.
