Dems 2019: Dem Hard With A Vengeance

Politics and religion
381

Maybe that’s what it is. There’s definitely overlap between Bernie’s fans and those who are claiming she’s so great.

But there definitely IS some weird suggestion that she’s a great progressive candidate, and that those claiming she isn’t are members of the dirty democratic establishment… It that that happened here in this thread already?

What I didn’t get was why folks who are fairly far left progressives, like Bernie’s fans, would like her, given that she doesn’t seem like a far left progressive at all. Some of her stuff is seemingly reactionary right.

I didn’t realize she was one of the first to support Bernie. But again, that seems like a really weird match, given her homophobia, support for authoritarian fascists, and religious oppression.

Maybe that’s just the stuff I’ve seen, and she’s real progressive on other stuff… but that still leaves me with the feeling that her positions on things are really weird and all over the place.

382

Hi, a Bernie fan here! (Or at least to the extent of the 2016 primaries).

Gabbard seems to have a weird mix of positions that leave her without any natural voter base. She has some progressive positions adapted later in life. She and her family have a long history of anti-LGBT efforts. She’s a vet, and has a vet’s dislike of Radical Islam. Finally, she wants to curtail our foreign wars in the vein of a Rand Paul.

All told, she has about 1/3 of a progressive, 1/3 of a republican, and 1/3 of a libertarian in her, which adds up to 0 in the democratic primary. Her progressivism is wasted, since we’re spoiled for choice in that regard in the primaries. We have 3? 4? absolutely wonderful progressive candidates with real history and fire and passion to back up their efforts. Gabbard seems like very weak and uncertain tea compared to them. And then Gabbard’s vehement anti-LGBT acts make her completely toxic to both the progressive and centrist wings of the democratic party. Her strong stance against The Terror might earn her points from Republicans, but then… her anti-war efforts make her completely toxic to them and the establishment media in general. The best I can say about her is that she seems to have been unfairly tarred with regard to Syria, e.g. not wanting to get involved in a civil war on the other side of the globe is painted as her being pro-Assad.

And just to round things out, let me add 2 characteristic quotes from the leftish-politics site I prefer:

“OK, so, back when marriage equality was first on it’s way to being the law of the land in Hawaii - and while Tulsi’s father, Mike Gabbard, was leading the fight against marriage equality - many of my friends went to protest in favor of marriage equality. To a person, they report to me that the whole Gabbard clan - including Tulsi - would show up and scream anti-Gay invective at them, their faces twisted with hate. Rep. Gabbard claims she’s changed, but in light of her father’s history of changing political parties (and occasionally positions) to get re-elected and her own evolving history of positions, I believe she’s a Mitt Romney, an Aaron Burr, a person who will say whatever needs to be said for a little power. My friends who saw her protesting call her The Manchurian Candidate and have for years.”

and

Gabbard is a fucking snake. In any sense except for the fact that she has a D next to her name she’s essentially a Reagan Republican.

383

Yeah, I think there may be some residual positive feeling for her as their first exposure to her was with the very well done endorsement video (Bernie had some of the greatest adverts) and, without knowing anything else about her, it seemed like this would be a prototypical candidate - female, veteran, diverse ethnicity and “non-standard” religion (for the US, obviously).

Once people dug deeper, the shine came off. But, for many, there was little reason to give her much thought after the Bernie endorsement; she hasn’t been part of the national conversation and didn’t directly factor into the lives of those not living in Hawaii. If she runs people will become more informed on her positions and those that value a wide variety of progressive positions will likely be able to make a better decision in regards to her.

384

It’s weird though that some folks seem to defend her the way Trump supporters do.

She has a bunch of conflicting stuff, just like Trump. And so folks just accept the parts they like, and excuse or ignore the other parts, or claim that it’s just some conspiracy against her.

385

In this Tulsi Gabbard thing going to be your next fixation after you’re finished keeping yourself up at nights over the “radical left” taking over the Democrats/country? :) Maybe I’m reading your posts wrong, but you sound like Gabbard is the leading candidate for the nomination and she’s got this huge backing. I doubt even 5% of primary voters even know a single policy position of hers.

I think once the campaign starts she washes out pretty quickly once her opponents inform the voters what her positions are.

386

“Some” folks will defend anything. But I don’t know what rock you have to turn over to find enough die-hard Gabbard supporters to prop up the position that it is somehow equivalent to the support Trump saw to get elected and continues to see despite being a total shit-storm.

At this point we might as well be discussing why there are those still supporting Vermin Supreme. If she starts garnering wider support for candidacy, then we can begin scratching heads and wringing hands.

387

Count me in the “Puzzled Over How Some Supposed Liberals Fawn Over Tulsi Gabbard” column as well.

388

I think Rothda did a nice job of explaining how her unique ideological stances make it difficult to see where her winning coalition/constituency will be in Democratic primary season.

389

Will Beto jump in?

390

This really happened too.

Lima-Taub signed an online petition that aimed to remove Tlaib from office and wrote a message about Tlaib on her personal Facebook page, according to the South Florida Sun-Sentinel.

“Proudly signed,” Lima-Taub wrote, according to a screen grab of the post. "A Hamas-loving anti-Semite has NO place in government! She is a danger and [I] would not put it past her to become a martyr and blow up Capitol Hill."

Tlaib also condemned the comments in a tweet on Tuesday, blaming President Trump and the Republicans because “this sort of hateful anti-Muslim rhetoric doesn’t happen in a vacuum.”

391

I’m in the “I have never met a liberal who fawns over Gabbard” camp.

392

Physically? In real life? Me too, but I’ve seen plenty on various platforms.

393

Gabbard is not my first choice for the nominee (she’s not in my top three), but the idea that she’s a Republican is overstating things. On almost every issue, she fits into the progressive wing of the party.

There are two, perhaps three exceptions. The first is Syria, where her position more or less matches Trump’s (get us out, leave Assad in power). Syria is not simple. It’s not the Bad Guys (Assad/ Russia) vs the Good Guys (Kurds and… ?). It’s a clusterfuck with very bad actors everywhere, and only a handful of those we would normally support. I disagree with her position, but I respect that her service in Iraq gives her a different perspective.

The other is LGBT issues. She changed her stance in 2012. Before that, she was against gay marriage. Is she sincere? I have no idea. If you’re looking for a crusader on LGBT rights, she’s not it. But she’s also not Mike Pence. At a bare minimum, I assume she can be trusted to follow along with the party on this, even if she does so grudgingly in her heart of hearts.

She’s been accused of being an Islamaphobe, partly because her views on radical islam are similar to Bill Maher’s. Her family also has ties to a very conservative party in India. But again, she’s not in the red-hat “put them in camps” crowd.

From an identity standpoint, she’s a young (37) woman of color who actually served in the armed forces. She’s also a pretty good speaker, and I suspect she’ll do well in the debates.

If LGBT issues are a top priority, I can understand why you’d distrust and dislike her. If you are firm that we should stay in Syria to topple Assad (and replace him with… who?), it also makes sense to oppose her. Speaking as someone mostly concerned with healthcare, climate change and voting rights, however, her positions look pretty reasonable at this stage. I’m sure we’ll learn more later.

I’d rather see Klobuchar, Gillibrand or Beto in the top spot. But Gabbard is not a republican ;)

394

It’s not weird at all, once you realize that Gabbard is 2020’s Jill Stein and look where Stein’s “support” came from.

395

Other than Gabbard’s position on Syria, is there evidence that she’s tied to Russia? Genuine question.

396

RT’s real keen on her. The russian bots are already pushing pro-Gabbard news, and she’s said some nice things about Putin.

397

Yeah - Gabbard is truly terrible

398

I’m in the “I have never met a liberal who even knows who Gabbard is” camp.

399

Seriously, she’s a nobody to the vast majority of people. I’m sure Russian bots will change that, but with her stances I don’t see her winning the Democratic primary. Trump was different, because he was appealing to the real base of the GOP.

400

There no way Gabbard goes anywhere. If it were just anti-gay votes and a few comments, maybe an apology works. But she worked with her family in a prominent anti gay organization that also did “conversion therapy.”