3061

I really enjoy how this game supports varying play styles, so that if I’m in the mood to stealth around and just knock people out, I can do that. And if I’m instead in the mood to headshot guys with the silenced pistol, I can do that, even in the next area. So I’m not getting bored with having to approach everything the same way.

3062

I think I’m closing in towards the end of the game, but I have probably 85% of the augs purchased and (mostly) maxed, so yes, praxis points are plentiful. But it is a bit rough in the early game, which is one reason why I am seriously dubious about the DLC’s apparent plan to disable all the augs for the duration. Really, guys? You think that was the fun part of your game?

PS:

WTF

3063

I was very unimpressed with the start myself, but it does get better as you get more augmentations. One big thing to realize, though, is that this isn’t really an RPG that rewards exploration – it’s a corridor shooter with lots of branching corridors. Just follow the quest arrows, don’t bother exploring unless you urgently need XP and supplies (and you probably won’t) or you deliberately want to circumvent some enemies.

  1. The default movement speed is so slow! Jesus it’s slow. I want to explore, I want to run around doing side quests, but it just feels really tedious trying to get anywhere.

I don’t have the impression that movement speed is slow (though sprinting is pathetic!), it’s just that the levels are so huge. Realistic but tedious to get around in, yes.

  1. I’m finding it slightly harder to navigate than I think is necessary. I’d love it at least if the map showed you a superimposed “you are here” even when you aren’t on the currently viewed level.

Also, what’s up with the ridiculously tiny amount of zooming out on the map? Can I get a proper overview map, please?

  1. In the course of making gameplay where you can choose alternate routes and alternate techniques, I feel like trying to do many simple things is overly complicated. It’s like “Hey, Mister? Why did you climb that ladder, climb into that window, go up three flights of stairs, get into an air vent, jump onto a ledge, and then climb back down?” “I had to go get a pack of gum at the local mini-mart, why, what do you do?”

Yeah, I agree. Paths are blocked off in the most arbitrary fashion, and that clashes oddly with the apparent realism of the level design. In the future, the residents of Detroit enter and leave their homes exclusively through fire escape ladders…

  1. In general, I feel like the game is “broken” until you spent a bunch of points on augs to fix it. Like the ridiculous “I must be drunk” rifle scope wobble. Or the way I’m currently loaded down with a bunch of side missions I can’t complete until I’ve but 3 more points into hacking, Or the really restricted takedown thing, until I spend more points beefing up my batteries. I hear eventually Praxis points are plentiful, but right now, my character literally feels less capable in some ways than I am in real life, (!?)

Agreed, just a few tips: don’t bother with more energy cells for take downs, only the first one regenerates anyway. Arm strength is surprisingly useful because a ton of stashes and passages are hidden behind breakable walls or heavy objects. Improved hacking is a no-brainer, just don’t bother with fortification or node analysis.

I dunno. After ME 1 and 2 and Bioshock and Far Cry 2, Deux Ex 3 just may not be the game for me.

Charles mentioned on his blog that DE3 gave the impression its designers had never played video games and were just handed a description of Deus Ex with the direction, “Implement this on a modern system!” The shooter/RPG combination of Deus Ex was amazing back then but has been copied and refined many times by now, and Human Revolution just completely ignores the evolution of the genre. IMO Alpha Protocol is a far better Deus Ex experience than DEHR.

3064

Only about half awake but wanted to get this down before it past me by.

Just finished the game; Never played any other entries in the series. I really loved DEHR. While it takes a bit to get going, once I got the hang of the combat/takedowns/stealth aspects, I was hooked. The game was just the right length. I clocked in at 52 hours on my run-through. I hacked everything I could find; I read everyone’s email; I looked around for every path through each encounter. I killed or subdued every bad guy who appeared on my radar, as well as other folks I felt crossed me. It never got old for a moment and I savored every hidden vent cover and each node layout. I played probably 75% straight combat and 25% stealth, in that I used sneaking to enhance my tactical position and get places I otherwise couldn’t; I tried for melee takedowns to maximize xp and shot folks when I had to. Actually, replace “had to” with “whenever I wanted”, including you, yappy civilian. I first put my points into Capture and then starting trying to add abilities that let me go places I presently couldn’t get to: First punch through walls, then 9ft jump, then Icarus, rebreather, elec. immunity, etc. I thought the power curve was just right, starting out as everyman, then totally confident, then sunglass-shaded killing machine. The first time I fell of a platform and Icarus saved me was incredible. I jumped off of stuff to watch that landing up to the end of the game.

The game played very much like “Fallout” to me, of which I am a big fan. The areas were somewhat small but Jensen’s someone lethargic run speed “assisted” with that. I never felt pinched in, though, and there seemed like plenty to roam through and explore. I totally agree with Razgon and Sir Digby: The soundtrack rules. I also loved the Blade Runner touches throughout the game and the other cyberpunk homagés.

I didn’t feel a connection with the bosses but I didn’t have much trouble with those fights. I had to reload more when I tried to take out large numbers of the regular troops, which I did a fair number of times.

There are a fair number of things to criticize: the pathing/AI issues, fused hands on the models, etc. I don’t want to dwell on them because no matter what the issues were, they paled in comparison to the ridiculous amount of fun I had playing DEHR. Between this and Bastion, it may have been my favorite month of all time.

3065

These are big words Chris.

IMO, Alpha Protocol did a very good job with the plot variations / reactivity on dialogue, and it was a fairly solid spy story, but that’s it, Deus Ex is much better in all the rest. And like you can read some pages back, i am not one who finds DXHR without fault.

And what games refined the ‘Deus Ex’ formula over the years? What evolution of the genre? We had Deus Ex IW (lol), AP, Vampire Bloodlines, and that’s it.

3066

This is basically how I’m playing right now, and I am also having a blast. I decided early that I didn’t really enjoy playing this game pure stealth and am going as heavy combat as I can manage. The game definitely seems to encourage a stealth build, but I’m trying to hold off on unlocking that stealth tree until upgrade points get plentiful. I’m having more fun jumping off buildings and throwing refrigerators.

3067

Interesting how some complete the game in 19 hours, and some in 50?

40 hours myself here, but 19 hours? Thats fast!

3068

I don’t think DEHR is significantly better in any respect than AP, and much worse in terms of writing and branching storyline (which virtually doesn’t exist here).

And what games refined the ‘Deus Ex’ formula over the years? What evolution of the genre? We had Deus Ex IW (lol), AP, Vampire Bloodlines, and that’s it.

That’s an extremely narrow definition. I agree that Human Revolution is the best game since Deus Ex that’s exactly like Deus Ex, but that’s just not very meaningful. It’s like saying that Starcraft 2 is the best RTS since Starcraft… if you only count RTSs that are exactly like Starcraft. I feel much the same about SC2 as about DEHR, by the way. Also, I actually liked Invisible War although I’m not sure from memory how it compares to DEHR.

If we look at Deus Ex from a broader perspective, it mixed four significant components: shooter (I don’t care if it’s first- or third-person, by the way); RPG-like system of experience points and upgrades; multiple alternative tactical approaches to combat; and branching conversations with NPCs. Well, today you’re hard put to find any shooter that doesn’t have the first three elements to some degree, excepting only some ultralinear console flagship shooters. Crysis 2 was the last shooter I played, and it had those elements. Adding NPC conversations with choices still leaves a whole bunch of modern games, from Stalker to Fallout 3. I honestly have no idea why only Vampire Bloodlines is supposed to match the Deus Ex formula while all those other games somehow don’t count.

3069

Well, so much for my pacifist run. I shot some random dude with my sniper dart rifle and instead of going to sleep, he went to dead. I guess that’s one less thing for me to worry about, so I guess I should be thanking the developers. Fuck you very much, Eidos, for relieving me of a burden I was actually willing to carry.

3070

I am still fully non-lethal (to the best of my knowledge) at this point, and it’s becoming a bit of a trial. Recent events have me itching to get my lethal revenge on the culprits, and it’s proving difficult to stay restrained. I find myself repeatedly going on righteous fury killing sprees when discovered, then sighing and reloading to do it without bloodshed.

3071

Epic:

and

3072

Actually Hunty, it wouldn’t bother me much at all if it were just difficult going non-lethal. I expect that. But when someone I take down with what I expect to be a non-lethal method instead kills the fellow, well that irritates me. Not enough to quit, I’m still enjoying the game, just kind of irked. Oh well, what can you do.

3073

I don’t think just tallying up features like this accurately captures the feel of games. To me, Vampire Bloodlines is very clearly from the Deus Ex linage, wheres Fallout 3 is more like the old school RPGs (like Ultima) but from a first person perspective.

That’s an extremely narrow definition. I agree that Human Revolution is the best game since Deus Ex that’s exactly like Deus Ex, but that’s just not very meaningful. It’s like saying that Starcraft 2 is the best RTS since Starcraft… if you only count RTSs that are exactly like Starcraft. I feel much the same about SC2 as about DEHR, by the way. Also, I actually liked Invisible War although I’m not sure from memory how it compares to DEHR.

I agree its a narrow definition, and deliberately so. Theres a certain cult of gamer (me included) who’ve wished since the Deus Ex/Thief days that this specific style of immersive sim would be popular enough that it would expand out and become an entire genre in its own right. It now looks like thats not going to happen, and in fact our best chance in the future of Deus Ex-alikes is for games like Fallout/Stalker/Far Cry to move even further into Deus Ex like territory. But they’ve not there yet.

I’m not saying DE3 is perfect, I’ve expressed some of my own misgivings earlier in this thread. But I’m still very happy to be playing the first game since Vampire Bloodlines that is following the DE1 legacy. (and I say that as someone who enjoys all those other games you mentioned).

Tony

3074

Stealth!

They both suck at boss fights though.

3075

Counterpoint: DXHR bosses were bad, but AP bosses were much worse.

3076

I wouldn’t even say that, a guy you’ve barely seen before appearing in a small room and blazing at you with a machine gun is about as bad as it gets… at least you had some interactions with the AP bosses, either before or after the fight. (Also in the original Deus Ex, by the way. HR is really singularly terrible at boss fights.)

3077

Oh, i was speaking balance wise. It’s true the characterization of AP bosses were better. In fact the style of the russian coke-crazy guy was great, but at the same time i almost leave the game in that fight.

3078

That is pretty bloody annoying to be sure. It may well have happened to me, too, and I just haven’t noticed. Though I am extremely sparing in my use of the tranquiliser rifle, which appears to be the most likely source of the bug.

As for the bosses, their lack of integration in the game proper is pretty lame. I’ve seen the one I assume is the second boss - thanks achievements list - twice so far, and never heard her speak. All I know is that she looks a bit like robo-Rihanna. For the first, I had four lines of dialogue and two poorly spelled, poorly written emails. Abysmally voice acted, too. He sounded like Foghorn Leghorn in an Iron Man suit. Kind of an immersion breaker.

It’s a strange oversight. If they’re not going to interact in the world, then surely a few more of those million incidental emails could have been from them or about them?

3079

I discovered this halfway through my 50 hour playthrough… but figured it didn’t matter.

Turns out it did…

So, yes, Fuck you Eidos.

3080

It can be a “bug” with the bodies having a tiny health pool. I have read on reddit a comment of one dude that said moving a body killed* it. …the game can’t tell the difference “killed by enviroment” vs “killed by adam jensen”.

*obviusly unconfirmed.