First off, I decided to put whether or not to allow Caelum (and Agartha, though no one has picked it) to a vote. Its not so much Caelum is overpowered like Lanka (I don’t think they are), its just the nature of recruitable tramplers. Mammoth are basically a newbie strategy (build a lot and watch the carnage) that require a more pro strategy to counter (specialized magic cast by many mages). As we do have newbs in the game, I’d rather have everyone focus more on traditional troop exchanges. If everyone signed up for Morning Star could post how they feel about the issue, that’d be great.
Hey, I like the idea of commando raids, lets players devise their own Ender’s game to… well… end the game. However, I’m not sure if you get the VP unless you take the fortress defending it. Now if thats the case, thats definitely a more involved process than just a simple raid and solves your concern on its own, I think. I’ll check on this later.
As for number of VP required to win, I’m going to vote 4 (everyone feel free to vote 4 or 5 or more if you really want). My reasoning being if two nations are stuck starting close together, they’d normally be at a disadvantage to a player who had no near neighbors. Now, if the VP count is low, then maybe the crunched up players have it slightly easier as more VPs are readily available. Once you make the jump to 5 VPs, then it becomes a game of domination no matter what. Of course, thats just theoretical thinking on my part.
So, three votes/opinions:
1)Allow Caelum or other nations with recruitable tramplers.
2)Number of VPs required to win.
3)How many turns VPs need to be held to win it.
In addition, I’d still need Votes on Number of Magic Sites and whether to turn off score charts. If you have any other opinions about the game and how you’d like to see it set up, be sure to voice them.
- Yes. Tramplers are a regular part of the game. Caelum is definetely not overpowered by any means - there are many nations in EA much stronger than Caelum. The only reason why I have picked it is that I never played Caelum before, and I thought it would be fun to try. If I would be looking for a powerful EA nation I would select one of the several other currently available nations.
And BTW mammoths are easy to counter. And Caelum’s infantry is the one of the worst in EA game. (weak and expensive size 3(!) troops; no sacred troops worth design points for any high bless strategy)
-
5 - For the same reasons that Baruk has mentioned
-
3 (Although I also love “Ender’s Game” - it’s a great novel. :) )
Sites: 50 - I like GreatAtlantic’s choice.
Scores: no.
Hetzer
4925
Im playing Atlantis,
Voting for settings:
50 sites
scores on
Uhhh im for allowing any nation… tramplers dont swim ;)
Alright, tramplers are in. If you’re new, be sure to think of ways to counter them, as normal infantry won’t work.
I’ve also checked Victory Conditions, there is NO WAY to make an automatic victory occur for holding on to VPs for a set amount of turns. Its you either have the VPs or you don’t. Also, you do not recieve a VP unless you capture the fortress in the province (and since Morning Star will be VP=somebody’s capitol, every one will have a fotress). So, the hold turn issue strikes me as moot, especially if we go 5 required VPs.
Meanwhile, Hetzer, I’ve got to warn you Paragonos is not a great map for water nations. There are two bodies of water seperated by many land provinces. The total number of water provinces is somewhat comprable to the number of land provinces you might otherwise have been able to nab. Your call, but if you want to be competitive with Atlantis on this map then its up to you to find a way to get on the land.
Are mammoths any more of a problem than any other one-sided matchups that can result from basic troop choices between nations?
I’ll go with 5 VPs and I don’t personally care about any of the other settings unless there’s a tie in the votes.
Oh, and put me down for Helheim.
Short Answer: Yes.
Explanation: Almost any recruitable unit is going to have one attack per turn, a few high quality units get two attacks. Rarer still are monstrous units such as the Hydra which will get quite a few more attacks. Regardless, unless the unit has quickness (achieveable only through magic or an expensive W9 bless), he can only attack one square of units, with most units limited to 1 unit in one square. What tramplers can do, is attack multiple squares per round, and hit all the units within the squares for at least some guarenteed damage. All this damage comes in a high HP package meaning its hard to kill. Get enough them, or combine the stack with high morale troops, and the mammoth block is nearly impossible to rout. I can’t think of anything else out there that comes close to recruitable tramplers in effectiveness. And in contrast to high bless nations, they are maximized by maximizing scales, something thats good for any nations in the long run anyways.
Of course, Mammoths and elephants both have low morale and more importantly low MR. This means they can be countered by mages and research and proper scripting. So in games with experienced players they are hardly unbeatable (though I wouldn’t say “easy”). My concern was we have beginner players who wouldn’t have a clue about the proper magics to stop mammoths and could potentially be frustrated by their presence. But if a majority is OK with their presence, I’m good to go on it.
EDIT: I wrote 3 paragraphs about different easy-to-use strategies how to counter and defeat tramplers, but then I’ve decided that it is not in my best interests to talk about various ways to defeat my own armies before the game. :) I will leave my conclusion though. (sorry if it would feel a bit disconnected)
….
….
Bottom line - frankly mammoths can be useful against AI, against human players they are usually a waste of money, unless the player has never encountered tramplers before. But in this case such inexperienced player would have much more difficult time handling sacred troops of Helheim, Tien Chi, Niefelheim - troops that present big challenge even for experienced opponents. GreatAtlantic is right, the player of these nations would have to spend points for the bless, but that’s not really relevant - anybody who play for example Helheim would surely invest in some good bless, and using sacred cavalry is easier than using tramplers. Besides Sauromatia’s Hydras (who by the way will eat three times their number of tramplers for breakfast) do not require any bless.
Hetzer
4930
He he every water nation has to get on land if it wants to win.
I just ordered this, and I’m hoping to join the next available game here since I hear the AI is somewhat stupid. Since I’ve never played a Dominions game, I’m going to have to learn fast to avoid losing exceptionally stupidly, so if anyone was willing to part with advice, strategy, or links to the same I’d appreciate. I’ve done the tiny tutorial and found some stuff on shrapnel’s forums, but a lot of it seems to be geared towards players who already know the basics and are looking into how to play specific nations, most of which I can’t even examine with just the demo.
It’s up to you of course, but you may want to play at least few games of SP first. It’s a good preparation for MP, allowing you to learn the ropes quickly. AI is not spectacular, but it should be more than adequate for a new player - if you have never played Dom before AI will certainly hand you your ass on a plate. I would suggest to start with Easy or Normal AI, once you mastered it upgrade to more difficult AI levels.
Dominions have very steep learning curve, and since a single MP game will take many months with 48 hours or so between turns, if you would try to learn everything in MP it will take you at least half of a year or more of regular games to learn the basics, and you will not have much fun in the process.
Also before joining MP game it’s a good idea to test your pretender build and your race in SP at least for a first 15-20 turns or so if you never played that race before. You don’t want to realize one month (of real time) into the game that you have made some stupid mistake with your pretender design and/or initial expansion tactics that are going to cost you the game.
wahoo
4933
Welcome to the addiction…i was in your shoes just a few months back. Read the tips for beginners at Shrapnel it really helps. I’d play a few solo games just to understand research and basic spells. Then pick a nation or two to play with. It’s much easier to play a MP game if you’re somewhat familiar with a nation. In SP, make sure you know a) flaming arrows b) fog warriors c) how to kill big monster units by magic. these can be tramplers, giants or big enemy summons. d) which spells are they favorites of everyone…thunderstrike, bladewind, etc.
The beauty of this game is that it’s a lot of rock/paper/scissors tactics but you need a sound overall strategy. The tactics is what can I use to beat the immediate army threat (to beat massed elephants, soul slay rocks).
As any wise coach would say, “Practice practice practice!”
Playing the AI is fine for practice. Just play around. The hardest part(s) for me was making sense of a pretender build and using it to my advantage strategically. Learning the “scales”, combos, spells, blessings, battle tactics…it just takes time and practice. And you don’t need to be an expert to join an MP game. Just get a few SP games under your belt and you’ll be ready to join the fray.
Like everyone else, I messed around with SP - but just long enough to be comfortable with the basics. Then I joined a great big MP game, made contact with one of my neighbors and said, basically, “I’m a noob. If you help me out with some pointers, I’ll be your faithful ally.” I learned a heckuva lot fairly quickly that way.
Hetzer
4936
Ok, you have swayed me… i´ll try mictlan once again… but this time i will rule…
So when are we planning to start?
Damn your hordes of troops, Tien Chi. I can kill them all, I just can’t catch them all.
Okay, new plan. I have 16 priests and a god here, I will PREACH your heathen ass out of this world, Dave!
baruk
4940
Gods in by Thursday. I’ve just sent mine.
Originally Posted by Greatatlantic
3.15 takes care of the scale bug, so its time to get the show on the road. I need everyone to pick a Pretender and email me (qt3dominions@gmail.com) the pretender file. All players also need to pick out a nation. I’m giving everyone a week to email their pretenders or your spot is up for grabs. Thats Thursday, 3/13.
