- +, I think. And change the size of the icons with < >.
It’s easy to miss, but there is also an arrow that appears to allow scrolling:
Wow, never did notice that little arrow before. Thanks!
I normally use the < to make them smaller, but even had that max out once and still needed to scroll.
Yeah, the plus and minus keys scroll up and down on the commander list. The battle log too when viewing battles.
I am so looking forward to the new patch. No water update yet, but those guys are boring anyway.
New MP game brewing in the MP Stabby Stabby thread. Register your interest there!
Perhaps a little late to say given its been out for a while but…
I’m really liking the Thrones system and how otherwise big maps can be “shrunk” into races. I played the heck out of Dom3 SP, transitioned to Dom4 and didn’t play it that much due to burning out from too much Dom3. Now I’ve rediscovered my love for this brilliant game and how Thrones tighten an otherwise long and sometimes pointless (when its all over bar the fat lady singing) end game.
Dominions is easily my most played game.
So, give or take something coming up, the new patch should ship in 2 weeks. I’m curious how the new pretender costs are going to line up.
With the mp game, I got again in the mood of more Dominions, but of course the turns advance slowly and in the early game they are very short. So I thought of playing too a sp game in between turns. Looking at ages and nations, I choose LA, because it’s where I played less, and Bogarus because Russian stuff is alien to me, and they have lots of cool toys.
Usually I write for myself a summary of the nation, in special to have a guide for their magic, but in Bogarus case I surprised myself writing more and more, in part because they have tons of mages, in part because I was doubting what strategy to use. So I decided to expand and reformat what I had written and post it here.
-Voi Spearman, Axeman, Archer.
Militia. They are cheap. The spearman is somewhat well equipped (he has a spear, shield and javelins) for being that price but the three of them have low morale (8)and low move (mm1). Archers maybe can be amassed at that price and used with Flaming Arrows/Wind Guide, but short bows are too low-tech in Late Age.
-Peshti Axeman, Spearman, City Guard.
Regular soldiers. Still not good. They have or mm1 (axeman, city guard) with encumbrance 7 or mm2 with low protection for the age (Spearman with prot11, just 3 more than the Voi version). The city guard has a nice defense of 14 and a broad sword but he pays for it with 20r, which seems a bit expensive. To be sure I compare him with another LA unit, for example like the Tower Guard from Man (both are mm1 infantry with castle defense 1 and similar prices), and yes, the Man unit for just 2g/2r more has better morale, better attack, defense and precision, less encumbrance, same kite shield + broad sword as the City guard but also adding a freaking crossbow. Ouch.
The Khlyst is one of those holy recruit-any-fort cheap units that in exchange are very crappy. I suppose someone can try doing a very gimmick bless strategy with them but… yeah I don’t see it. Their actual but still gimmicky use is using their stealth and unrest properties as disruptions in enemy territory. You even have two stealthy commanders with the same unrest attribute to lead them.
-Grid Druzhina, Malaia Druzhina.
The last two units, we could put them the tag of medium and heavy cavalry.
The Grid are horse archers (composite bows, but it doesn’t matter a lot with their Precision 8) with broad swords, the Malaia is the typical more expensive heavy cavalry with good stats and lance + shield + broad sword.
-Black Hood, Styag.
More cavalry, these ones can be recruited outside forts. I’m starting to think Bogarus is a horse-heavy nation. Black Hoods are like slightly cheaper and crappier Grid Druzhinas, they have 2 more precision but clearly worse at melee (-1hp, -3prot, -1morale, -1att, -2def, maces instead broad swords), so I suppose they are more to supplement your forces here and there. Styag is a lance version with standard and better armor, so he can be a good addition to your forces.
And that’s it, Bogarus doesn’t have an efficient middle quality infantry to use as core of your army nor the typical elite cap-only unit, usually holy, that other nations have. In exchange the relatively good unit it has (Malaia Druzhina) can be recruited in all the forts, but at 45g/42r (and the infantry at costs like 10g/18r or 11g/20r, they lean on resources) I’m going to need something like O2P1 scales to produce them without problems, and given their quality you need them in numbers.
I don’t really see in what unit I should focus, at least for expansion. I thought maybe Grid Druzhinas, they can peper the enemies with arrows and then charge with their swords and they have def 14 thanks to being mounted units, but their lack of shields and their averageish prot (for the Age) of 13, and their normal morale of 11 makes it me believe they will have heavy casualties against crossbows and they can route in pitched battles.
-Scout. Normal scout.
-Voivode. Normal infantry commander. 60 ldr.
-Knyaz. Normal cavalry commander, 80 ldr.
-Veliki Knayz. Good cavalry commander. 120 ldr + inspirational.
Ahh, so Bogarus have crappy troops but good leaders. Other nations start with a 40ldr commander and ends with a 80ldr commander. We start at 60 and end in a really good leader. I can see now our armies holding up in big battles with +3 leadership, +4 with standard, maybe more with items.
The boss of Khlyst troops. Same deal as them, it’s stealthy + unrest, and it can lead up 40 of them. As a bonus he is also a priest, so he can preach in enemy territory and bless with own Khlysts in case they are discovered without the problem of not having a priest at hand because the usual priests aren’t stealthy.
Your holy 2, holy 3 priests. Another good point of the nation, they have good priests. Eparchs are cap only but it isn’t like you are going to need a dozen of them.
Here the we discover the deal with Bogarus. Crappy army, but good leaders, priests… and mages. In this case, very good magic diversity. They have lots of mages!
-Occultist. S1D1B1 100g.
Cheap communion slave meat? He also is a blood hunter once he has a dowsing rod. D1 isn’t very useful, but the combination of crosspaths is always good because it gives you access to better stuff. For example in combat he can use Nether bold/Darts (S1D1) which is pretty good for being level 1 combat spells. He can also summon groups of Bone Fiends (D1B1).
-Kalendologist. S2 105g.
Your cheap Astral guy. He can use Stellar Cascades against troops, Solar Rays against undead, Paralyze against dangerous beasts like elephants and Mind Burn against thugs. He can spam Horror Mark if you go for a Horror strategy in the late game.
Of course they can reach Astral 5 with the starshine skullcap they forge, more Power of the Spheres and Light of the Northern Star and then cast bigger stuff.
-Atrapelagist. A2S1 125g.
Your Air mage. A2 means Lightning Bolt (and Wind Guide for your army), but with Astral he can communion up and throw some Thunder strikes. If you take a Pretender with Air you could be able to throw Storm and then Thunder strike directly.
-Alchemist. F1E1S1, 135g.
Not a powerful combat mage at first look (though he can use Magma Bolts), but again the three paths means bigger variety of some niche spells and items he can cast and forge. Particularly at forging, he can forge 56 different items, including Fire Brand, Helmet of Heroes, Lightless Lantern, Crystal and Slave Matrix.
Give him Earth Boots (empower just one to E2, he can make them for the rest and forge a dwarven hammer for himself), a Starshine cap and a Skull of Fire (your other mages can make them) and the number of items he can make with F2E2S2 is hilarious.
-Master of Names. S2+100% (F1A1B1) 155g.
17 RP for 155g non-STR, non-Cap only, non-old* mage? Yes. Yes I will take it. Your main researcher.
*:actually he starts only 2 years away from being old :(. Still a good deal.
-Fivefold Angel. B2H2 225g.
A weird (and creepy!) unit. He is like a Skopets (stealth commander with unrest) but better, as he’s also a spy, a better leader (80 ldr), better priest and provokes more unrest. Additionally he is your Blood 2 mage.
Stuff he can do: Black Heart for himself and turn into a blood mage-assassin, Boots of Youth for the old mages, Blood Feast to heal his starting afflictions, Agony, Harm and Hellbind Heart to attack, summon fiends and spine devils and boost them with Blood Lust.
-Starets. F2A1S2B1+100% (A1S1D1B1) +10% (F1A1S1B1) 255 g.
Your STR, cap only mage. But 6 paths and a great researcher! Shamefully he is pretty old, but there are some ways to get around that.
He can cast: Sulphur Haze, Hellfire, Bind Firey Imps, Fire3 spells with Phoenix Power, Flaming Arrows with Skull of Fire.
The main variations are
F2A2S2B1 : Bind Storm Demons (blood b.)
F2A1S3B1 : Astral Fires
F2A1S2B2 : Bind Devil, Bind ArchDevil (2 blood b.)
F2A1S2B1D1 : Nether Bolt, Nether Darts, Bane Fire Dart, Corpse man Construction, Ether Gate (2 astral b.), Vengeance of the Dead (1 astral b.), Blood Rite (1 astral b., 1 death b.)
Btw, except your Fivefold Angels, none of the mages are sacred, same with the military commanders except the Skopets. It’s important because you can’t use Air bless to improve the mage’s precision nor give them reinvigoration with Earth and you will pay full cost of maintenance of your many mages, unlike sacred mages.
All their national spells are conjurations. Let’s see:
-Simargl. Conj2 , 1 Air gem.
A cheap patroller. 5 air gems means a patrol equivalent to 55 soldiers. Interesting, given you can do blood with Bogarus and you need the patrols to reduce unrest.
-Firebird. Conj 3, 2 fire gems.
Flying unit with +2% to positive events. I wouldn’t bother using it in combat, but I would have five of them in my capital just for the +10% chance of good events each turn for just 10 fire gems.
-Sloth of Beards. Con3, 10 nature gems.
A sink for the nature gems, as you don’t have a lot of use for them at first.
-Sirin. Conj3, 8 astral gems.
Flying seducer. No idea of how effective it is, I don’t have lots of experience with the mechanics of dream seduction. In any case for 8 gems you have a flying mm3 scout which is nice.
-Likho. Conj4, 10 death gems.
Summonable by our Occultists. Another unrest unit to stay behind enemy lines, in her case provoking bad events, I wouldn’t make a lot of them, but I suppose having two of them in the enemy capital is good business.
-Alkonost. Conj4, 15 astral gems.
Flying H3 commander, to capture thrones? It has inspirational +2 but it’s of limited use because it only has Leadership 40. It also has Awe and good Awe even (+5) but I wouldn’t use it in combat, it isn’t beefy enough. You army isn’t really depending of blessing so as a mobile divine blessing dispenser isn’t also very useful, so yeah, I can only think of invoking one to capture thrones.
-Rusalka. Conj4, 16 water gems. W1D1.
Another female-monster seducer, though in this case what you are really paying it’s for a W1D1 amphibious mage with Waterbreathing 10; but the big problem is how it needs a W1D1 mage to summon her in first place and water gems you surely don’t have. You can use your Rainbow pretender for that, as we will see, the big magic variety makes for a good case for a Rainbow.
She can forge Water bracelet and Water lens for herself and Frost Brands and boots of quickness for thugs. Hell she can try to clean PD underwater, escort her with 10 knights thanks to water breathing, summon first a big Water Elemental(extra regen UW) with the temporary water gem and then finish up the enemies with her Frost Brand + Stygian skin.
-Vodyanoy. Conj4, 20 water gems. W3N1.
Aquatic W3N1 mage, once you finally get a Rusalka, forge a Water Bracelet, equip it, and summon him, it will secure your Water access for forging wit W3. Being aquatic only your focus won’t be on him, but I still would make one so he can forge lots of Clam of Pearls for the Astral mages.
-Bukavac. Conj5, 5 water gems.
Aquatic mosnter, summonable by the Vodyanoy with Water Bracelet. Big, good morale and magic res, with trample, multiple attacks and fear. And cheap! A few of them and a pair of the previous water mages on their back and you should be able to clear sea provinces easily. Not bad for a land nation.
-Zmey. Conj5, 8 fire gems.
A three-headed dragon. He is basically a souped up fire drake. His fire breath has more range, he makes more damage in melee, he flies, has more hp, prot, magic res, morale, attack and defense. Still, saying “souped up fire drake” isn’t a lot given how bad they are :P. Even then, they seem an ok use of fire gems at least against some armies and not a direct waste unlike other fire summon options.
-Midday. Conj5, 10 air gems.
Flying ethereal assassin with fear, she has a weapon that causes diseases. For 10 gems apiece you can make a pair and see what they can kill. She only has two misc slots, but Skull Talisman and Imp Familiar, and later Bottle of living water are accessible and cheap summoning-units items that would go well in her slots.
-Gamayun. Conj5, 25 astral gems. A2S2H2.
Flying seducer and fortune teller A2S2H2 mage, and some nice bonus like awe and adept researcher.
Not worth it I think. You already have a A2S1 national mage, she can’t cast any new spell or forge a new item with that extra path, you have good priests and good researchers so you don’t win anything new for 25 gems.
-Beregina. Conj6, 35 water gems. W3E1N2
W3E1N2 amphibious mage. Rusalka big sister. Her magic path sounds good to increase your magic diversity, but the problem is, you don’t have anyone who can summon her! Only way would be with a Pretender or empowering a Vodyanoy in Earth with 50 Earth gems, which doesn’t sound good.
-Cloud Vila. Conj7, 40 air gems. A3S1N2
Flying seducer A3S1N2 mage. Again you don’t have anyone to summon it, but in this case it’s worth considering taking a Pretender that can summon him with Air 4. Why? Two reasons: One, she is Healer, so just having one in your research center healing your old mages and other in your main army doing the same may be worth it. Two, his A3 synergizes well with your Astraspelagists, just have your A4 Pretender forge too a Winged Helmet for them and they are ready so summon Storms. Or they can communion up to reach A4 more easily than Astrapelagists, if you don’t have the gems.
-Mountain Vila. Conj 7, 40 nature gems. A2S1N3
…Or instead of A4, take a N4 Pretender to summon Mountain Vilas which can heal two units in a month instead of one. They don’t synergize as well with the Air mages but the N3 brings even more magical diversity to your nation, mainly to buff your armies. And her sprite rocks
-Leshiy. Conj8, 60 nature gems. A2W1E2N4
The most powerful national summon is… a bit underwhelming, to be honest. 60 gems and a tailored Pretender to summon him, he is a A2W1E2N4 mage that loses 1 in each path outside forests. In forests he can transform into a size 6 trampler berserk bear. That’s good, but I don’t think it’s good enough to pay the entry price.
In summary you have a Nation with a kind of crappy army but with good magic, more exactly with great variety, but that combination makes it what we could call an “advanced nation”, as you really need your way around magic to do it well with them. I’m still trying to juggle 7 different mages in my head, and a few more in summons. You literally have access to all the magic paths in the game with this nation (not including the Leshiy in the list!):
Fire: Starets, Alchemists, MoN
Water: Rusalka, Vodyanoy, Beregina
Air: Starets, Astrapelagist, MoN, Cloud Vila, Gamayun, Mountain Vila
Earth: Alchemist, Beregina
Astral: Six national mages, three summons
Nature: Vodyanoy, Beregina, Cloud V, Mountain V
Death: Occultist, Rusalka
Blood: Starets, Occultist, Fivefold Angel
Another interesting point in the design of the nation is the theme of covert warfare you can deploy. Why? Well, you have unrest provoking including units and 2 commanders, 1 bad event provoking unit, 2 normal seduction units, 1 dream seduction unit, 1 spy and 1 assassin. That’s like, a entire C.I.A. cell.
Strategy and Pretender
The basis of my army I think is going to be a mix of:
25% Peshtsi Spearman as shield screen. I suspect they are going to be replenished every few battles.
40% Grid Druzhina firing arrows
35% Malaia Druzhina holding in the back and charging
?% some extra Black Hoods groups as you recruit a few of them here and there and send them to the war front.
All leaded up by Veliki Knyaz with Crowns of Command or Helmet of Heroes and Styags in each squad. That should be +5 or +6 morale to each squad.
Researcher: Master of Names, MoN in outside forts and Starets in cap later.
Magic support in early game to mid game:
-Occultists with Nether evoc against big armies of chaff or…
-Astrapelagists against smaller armies that are better armored.
-A pair of Kalendologist in arch army to increase magic flexibility.
-One Astrapelagist for Wind Guide.
In mid game to late game:
-More focus in Astrapelagists doing communion for Thunder Strike.
-Starets with booster for Flaming Arrows, in communion with Alchemists or MoN with Fire random for bigger Fire spells.
-Astrapelagists in communion with Starets, MoN with Air random or other Astrapelagists for Storm and Arrow Fend.
That’s mostly evocations and offensive power. But the army is still lacking in buffs, so finally the Pretender is going to take Nature, that way we can add:
-Pretender or Mountain Vilas to use Nature and use big spells: Mass Regen, Army of Giants and Mass Protection for your army. Creeping Doom and Howl too.
Astral Corruption and Horrors!
The true reason to choose it is because I never used it before and wanted to give it a try, it isn’t truly needed nor the nation adapt itself as well as other ones like MA/LA Abysia, Mictlan or LA Ulm to do it, though it’s possible. We don’t have complete Blood+Astral paths but:
-Occultist with two boosters can cast ‘call lesser horror’
-MoN with random blood needs two boosters (a blood item and an astral item) to cast ‘call lesser horror’ and ‘send lesser horror’
-Starets with random blood and the two boosters can ‘call horror’, and an extra astral item (or the 10% random) to cast ‘Send Horror’ and ‘Dream Horror’.
-Pretender can cast everything of course.
All together, given the nation has good magic spread and even greater spread with the summons, and add the fact it doesn’t need any particular bless for the units, I think the best is to embrace that wide magic spread and take a Rainbow pretender, to secure a good and varied gem income and access to National summons, and choosing well the scores we can make a Pretender which at the same time it can cast Astral Corruption as I want.
Pretender has to be N4S4B3W2
Armor: Armor of Twisting Thorns
Weapon: Blood Thorn (or Thistle Mace)
Misc2: Crystal Coin
Misc: Brazen Vessel
Head: Starshine cap
It gives +3 Blood,+1 Nature,+2 Astral, that buff us to N5S6B6
Water2 is just for the water income and water summons, it’s optional
Globals in our reach are then:
Astral Corruption (S6B6)
Mother Oak (N5)
Eyes of God (S5)
Stellar Focus (S5)
(and changing the Blood thorn for a Thistle Mace);
Gift of Health (N6)
Wild Hunt (N6)
Finally, I got this
The other way would be to fix the weakness of the nation with the Pretender instead of trying to boost their strength, in this case it would be to take a SC Awake Pretender to compensate the initiak weakness of our army, instead of a Rainbow. In exchange you would have to choose between Water/Nature support and Astral/Blood possibilities.
Feel free to make suggestion, correct me, etc.
I am curios how the pretender selection will change after the patch drops.
Yep, in this particular case I noticed how little difference there was between a human Rainbow Pretender and the Volla. Even after buying 3 extra paths to the Volla she was better than the human option, with same scales, magical paths and dominion. And better monster Pretenders will also be good, right now people only use the Dragons, which is pretty limited.
Update released in Steam !!!
His ring doesn’t do anything, but he can change shape into Linormr, which also is a separate Pretender for less points:
Please show us more!
With the cost and the powerful creature summoned by this, I would imagine the creature would disappear after the attack during the magic phase, but still could be quite a useful spell. If you got to send them 4 provinces and keep them, that would be pretty incredible. I could be wrong, though. Let us know if you try it out :).
I started the game this morning, against Mighty AI.
The problem now is that the AI just declared me war. 3 at the same time. :(
First there was peace and I just finished taking the indies provinces available in the area, so I had the luxury of choosing a target, and I chose Pangea as the one to attack, because they had less defenders. But before I did it (I still wanted to move my bigger army that was in the South to the North before ataccking), they were the ones that attacked, taking a province. I counter attacked capturing two provinces from them. And then the next turn Agharta formally declared war and attacked in two provinces and the next turn Gath did the same, moment where I raised my arms to the sky and asked WHY. From 0 enemies to 3 enemies in three turns, all done by them. I still have to try and somehow solve it. I think I could beat Pangea in merely a dozen turns, but I will need my armies to defend from the other 2 more powerful enemies. And problem is, that nice river in the west side is crossable everywhere with my Cold 3 dominion.
That’s a lovely map - where can I get that one? Or did it come with the game and I missed it?
Look at the signature of this guy
He has links for his maps in this line
“Atha Avin - Biddyn - Peliwyr (127+18) (Wraparound) - Hexawyr (225 + 33)”
They all use the same lovely style, though Hexawyr is the only one with that terrain distribution based on hexes.
Yeah, I was just thinking the same thing.
Thanks for the links, TurinTur! I may have to check that map out.