It’s hard to tell where someone’s interests lie when it comes to RPG combat, but it sounds like he was having fun with all the super moves. That’s how I figure it’ll be.

The tough choices are back. I’m eager to see how those play out over the timeline. I’m glad they didn’t go the ME2 route and let you solve them with enough powergaming, or leave the consequences until the third game in the series.

You know, if a modder hacks in a free-floating camera this might turn out to be pretty good. Still not paying $60 though.

Wow, that truly is terrible. It’s one of the few design decisions I disliked about BG2. : /

Hey, at least we don’t have to visit 3 parallel planets before wrapping it up in the finale.

I can see how you would see it this way if you only played the first 10 minutes of the demo (and I’m seeing a lot of people who are critical of the demo throwing this particular example out there), but it sure didn’t seem to me that it was all about “cannon fodder” when you were back to a level one character or even the later fight with Isabela around. In fact, a lot of people agree that the Isabela/city stuff is very similar to what we saw in city fights in DAO and DAA. So do you really think the later fights are super easy or are you just basing it on the intentionally exagerrated opening section?

The demo was significantly easier than DA. In DA you would have a hard time without someone who knew heal and have to focus a lot on healing potions. In the demo for Dragon Effect 2 most sections are quite easy even not having a heal capable mage.

Only the ogre really was dangerous for me playing a mage without heal and a lot of this was due to party members not doing the best thing. If i had been playing on the pc i could have easily micromanaged my party members around if the controls are even half as good as in da1. Hell, if i had spent more time messing with tactics in the demo and/or switched around more, i could have done it on ps3 even probably.

That depends entirely on the difficulty level, though, right? The demo was locked on “normal” difficulty and they’ve already said that normal is easier this time because a lot of people complained it was too hard. Even people on QT3 thought the difficulty jump from easy to normal was too great. And how many heal capable mages were around in the early part of DAO if you weren’t one of them, anyway? Most of the origins didn’t have them, for example. And even later when things got a lot harder you could still get by without a heal capable mage - I made Morrigan an AOE mage and had her team up with 2 warriors and a rogue most of the time.

It’s a demo. It’s not going to tell you how difficult the game is or how much your decisions will impact the game world or give you any real sense of the characters. All it really does is show you how the combat system is different from the first game and give you a taste of the art style changes.

Yes, i agree that the full game may be different, especially at higher difficluty levels, but i do strongly disagree with your opinion in the previous post. Obviously the super powered section is easy, but beyond that the gameplay is the same throughout the demo except during the ogre fight when things done get serious. Near mindless hack and slash.

Exactly. And it shows the way encounters are supposed to be designed now in DA2 - more numerous, faster but weaker enemies that spawn all over the area, less dangerous mages (no real need to kill them first), no need for healing or crowd control, no even opportunity for crowd control because everything moves so fast and gets bunched up together now, no friendly fire for the same reason, mages are ok tanking a few enemies, etc.

DA2 seems to be a weird example of a game deciding to go from tactical to action oriented but getting stuck somewhere in the middle, where it’s too fast to be tactical but contains way too many abilities/spells that are not really needed in an action game.

As for the difficulty, given the demo’s half-assed build quality, I’d agree that it’s impossible to tell how hard or easy the full game is going to be. However, in the demo I was constantly under impression that I am not really needed there. Most of the battles (except the ogre of course) I could park myself in the corner and my party would still win. You could fight without using any of the abilities and be fine. What’s the point then? Oh I forgot - the rouge looks so cool when he cartwheels around! :)

Steam Christmas sale game for sure.

With two mages you could basically pound your head on the keyboard and emerge victorious from most battles in the original. I actually died to the ogre three times on my rogue, so I’m going to wait and see how the full game plays before declaring this any easier than DA:O.

Ha, well that’s what I get for opening my mouth without knowing the context!

I am sort of depressed with how Bioware handles their sequels though. They always give you this pretty massive choices in a game, then talk about how you “really need to hold onto the save file for the next game”! Then they write the next game in such a way that your decisions in the previous one really don’t actually change anything meaningful. It’s such a tease.

Chris Woods

I got the demo from Steam, so this is the PC version.

Had to log into my EA account (which I forgot I had!) to play the demo, and I think there was something written about bonus items for beating the demo.

Demo Specifics:

-A lot of options are greyed out and unavailable. This includes difficulty, which is locked to normal. I was able to turn on subtitles, but character appearances are locked.

-The demo does not let players interact with inventory. However, there are at least weapon slot(s), a helmet slot, an armor slot, and probably an accessory slot. I do not recall looting gloves or boots, so they may have been cut.

-Demo is essentially combat focused. Players seem to play the opening segment, and then jump ahead to a later segment (and bumped up to a higher level) with a little explanation. However, the new dialogue system is also on display.

-I rate the demo 1/5 on the Spoiler Scale, with 0/5 being no Spoilers whatsoever.

Combat Specific

-Combat comes across as a lot more frantic and fast paced, though I think most of that is the brisker animation. In the case of the rogue, this seems appropriate. However, watching Warrior characters move 2-handed weapons like butter knifes is a bit off putting.

-Combat itself still has the potential to be similar to Origin’s more tactical approach, but the loss of the overhead vantages does diminish this. The pause button still works, “threat” still needs to be managed. AoE attacks should be carefully used to maximize damage. Actually, in the demo AoE attacks were outright overpowered.

-I think I prefer the new interface. It just seems cleaner and simpler which means it conveys information better. One change I like is health bars now are bigger for characters with more health. Makes it easier to prioritize healing.

-Playing the NPC mage was fun with the AoE spells, however, a PC mage with a focus on healing and support was kind of boring. The Heal spell took a long time to recharge.

Dialogue

-Traditional RPG dialogue (Fallout, Baldur’s Gate) is gone. It is replaced with a combination of Alpha Protocol and Mass Effect. There is no timer, players choose responses from a wheel, and for any given response players can choose from one of three dialogue options, which I am going to call benevolent, jocular, and austere. Thank you 6th grade vocabulary!

-Character is fully voiced, and the game suffers from the same problem as Mass Effect. What the voice actor says can be very different than what the text says.

-The dialogue options are all associated with symbols, with different “moods” having multiple symbols. For example, jocular responses while always purple can either be a “gem” or the classic “theater comedy mask.” It is not clear if these symbols have greater influence.

-There were no “Persuade” Checks in the demo. I would have to check the character screen again, but I do not recall conversation checks being mentioned there either.

Character Creation

-It was very disappointing to start and having only 6 variations of the same flavor to pick as a character. You play a male or female Hawke, and chose a class of either Mage, Warrior, or Rogue. The demo offered no further customization until the first level up.

-Upon leveling up, players can go to the character screen and distribute 3 attribute points and 1 talent. Talents now use more complex trees and as far as I can tell no longer use minimum attributes to determine talent eligibility. Instead, some talents require a minimum player level, certain other talents to already be taken, and/or so many points already expended in that talent tree.

-Each class seems to have 2 “base” talent tree, e.g. weapon and shield and 2-handed weapons for the warrior, and 4 more support orient trees. Mage, however, just has the different spell trees.

-Skill Points appear to be gone entirely.

-The Character Screen makes it a lot easier to keep track of what attributes do. However, attributes appear to be simplified. Strength improves warriors damage and attack, while Dexterity does the same for rogues. I worry this will make Attributes to simple to distribute (e.g. pour all points into characters primary attribute).

NPCs

-The Demo comes with 4 or 5. One is not playable, but may be in the full game.

-NPC relationship to the player is now monitored with a Friendship/Rival meter to replace Like/Dislike. Strikes me as a simplification, especially considering how Companion opinion of player’s actions was the game’s only moral system.

-I noticed at least one NPC has two separate, passive talents which depended on the characters relation to the PC: one for friendship, the other for rival. Could be an interested.

-Massive Clevage is every where. I think the developers are compensating for a lack of “jiggle physics.” Or, just plain compensating.

Story

-Not much to tell from the Demo. Except your character is known as “the Champion,” who is not to be confused with “the Cape.”

-Narratively, the game using a framing narrative, or a story within a story. Similar to Alpha Protocol, except instead of the PC being grilled, it is an NPC. Essentially, events are taking place in the past, as an NPC is interogatted by an Orleasian Chantry “Seeker.” This could be used for some interesting narrative events.

-Apparently, the world is at the bring of war and only the Champion can save it. I dislike narratives that require the rest of the world to hold idiot balls to make the PC the most important character in the universe. Yet, like I said, the demo does not tell us much, so maybe Bioware will pull it off.

Conclusion

I’ve gone on long enough. This still is Dragon Age, or at least has a potential to match Origin’s tactical combat and morally bleak narrative. The $60 price tag is a turn off for me, but RPGs are rare enough that I still feel comfortable ponying up the money to buy it.

Also…DA2 is a story within a story…she may possibly just look that way because that’s how the storyteller is describing her. Just a thought.

If NPCs changed their look based on who is telling that bit of the story, that would be surprisingly cool. I doubt it’s going to happen, though, as they’d need several different models for each character and many players would get confused.

There appear to be subtle (or even less subtle) differences between the two versions of the dwarfs account of Hawke’s escape from the blight just in the demo. Bethany’s “assets” are much more prominent in the exagerated version, and both Hawke and Bethany’s armor is different as well, just to name two examples.

Actually I had the last fight in the mind while writing that. And I was not digging into the difficulty. It is a BioWare game, so I was not really expecting any sort of balances. My point is that the game as a whole is very poorly made. Take the said fight for example, it happens in a T-shaped room. The fight begins with the enemy in the middle, and throughout the fight the cannon fodder will enter the fight from the three end-points. This design itself is not the problem and in fact could result as a very fun/challenging encounter. However, combined with a gimped camera and a level design that lacks visual/audio cues to support such encounter, any chances of a player making intellectual tactical choice is impossible.

If all the battles end up following that pattern then I can see your point. But even in the demo that’s not always the case. The first few fights in the second part, for example, have specific numbers of enemies who are all there at the start and the battle ends when they are defeated.

We’re going to have to see the full game to know for sure on that issue.

Here’s a long hosted clip of gameplay.

http://uk.gamespot.com/shows/now-playing/

Be aware that there are some spoilers about plot structure and a particular companion but there are also some different environments to look at (though all still in the city). There is a potentially major spoiler late in the clip (around the 27:00 mark), at least if you assume it was a slip of the tongue and not a weird choice of words.

Can I ask how a camera that won’t zoom to an isometric level is ‘gimped’? It’s certainly different, but I can pan it around easily and quickly judge what’s going on in the battlefields in the demo.

It is gimped compared to previous games made by Bioware, also DA:O, in which many used to to cast spells and get an even better overview over whats going on.

Something else from that clip that I’d either forgotten about or never realized: they are doing the same thing with companion appearance (i.e. armor) as they did in ME2. As you may recall, companions always wore the same clothes in ME2 but you could open up an alternate appearance for them with a better relationship. There was no armor swapping going on. The locked inventory in the demo hid the fact that something similar is happening in DA2 but Laidlaw mentions it. Weapons can still be changed, though apparently the dwarf guy refuses to use any other crossbow then his official one. There is some talk about upgrades but I’m not clear if that applies only to weapons or to companion armor as well.