Europa Universalis 3: The Reckoning!

What Stormbinder said.

I think the real difference is the lack of historical context for the generi-events. The actual game consequences are much the same, but you no longer get the miniature history lesson to go with them.

I’m torn. On one hand, it makes for better gameplay when you’re not constantly anticipating scripted events. On the other hand, I liked scripted events and the feeling of playing a historical sim.

This has been a constant and recurring argument on the Paradox Forums IIRC. Basically there are two camps, one that feels historical events are fun and interesting, and the other that considers them a straitjacket, the “why don’t you just read a history book” crowd.

Well I guess Paradox decided to change things up a bit this time. Not the end of the world for me… I am sure there will be an EU4 someday :D And who knows maybe EU3 is actually just a really good game in it’s own right, eye-melting graphics aside ;)

I’m torn. On one hand, the game feels oddly soulless when I don’t have any historical hooks for my actions. On the other hand, just now in my game England had the equivalent of the Habsburg inheritance, where they inherited all of Austria and the english king became the Holy Roman Emperor. It makes for a great experience and great game dynamics (England has to divert resources from colonial efforts to defend their new lands), but is so far outside the scope of real history that you just can’t make sense of it in that context.

It’s a tough call. I like the game quite a lot, but there is no denying that the historic events and leaders added character to the game that is now missing. It doesn’t help that many of the events are so bland. Calling a revolt a “Basque revolt” just because there is a script that looks for a minority group doesn’t make it a Basque revolt - the event is too localized and, as Kalle says, ripped from context.

But the new dynamism of the game allows you to carve out your own history. Brandenburg might not go Protestant, Venice can have a huge colonial empire, Vijaynagar can unite the subcontinent. Every game is uniquely different in a way that the EU2 games weren’t.

So, I miss the Liberum Veto event, but I don’t miss it happening when my Polish kingdom is maxed out on centralization.

Troy

Here’s an idea… make historical events an option.

— Alan

Yes, I thought about it, but I am not sure it is possible.

At minimum, it would require a drastic change to the game. Not to mention huge amount of balancing, teaching different AIs handling their historical events intelligently, testing, etc.

I am 100% certain Paradox will not do it now, not after resisting this very change for 3 years. So it would fall to the modders. But like I said, I am not even sure it is technically possible given changes to EU3’s design and philosophy.

This thread depresses me. I should get my copy today, but I’m already soured on the game. I thought the EU2 events were perfect–most had elaborate pre-conditions and time ranges, but if the stars aligned, they happened. No game exactly duplicated history–nor should it have–but enough things were the same to give EU2 both verisimilitude and player freedom.

I’ll give EU3 a try, but I suspect it’s going to collect dust until the mod community makes it into the game I’d prefer to play.

Actually most of them had very simple preconditions in vanilla EU2, though modders did a lot of work to mix it up a little. The French Revolution certainly had different outcome options depending on where your sliders were, but Time of Troubles, the five hundred Japanese revolt events, the expulsion of the Moors…these events just checked if the country was still around and what year it was.

There was some discussion about making historical events and leaders an option in the development phase, but they chose not to go in that direction.

Troy

Yeah, it depresses me too. ;( I was really looking forward to EU3, but now I don’t think I am not going to buy it, unless modders will do the miracle and bring back the historical feel of the game.

I had a look at the events folder and while I can’t say for sure it looks like they’re using the same type of event scripts as in the previous games. They’ve added some new variables for advisors and national ideas as far as I can tell, but it should be just as easy to modify as EU2 which means we’ll see some ginormous events packs eventually.

Yeah, I’m gonna toy with some AGC-EEP events for a small country and see how difficult it is to port. They do seem to be making an effort at better documentation for modders.

Has anyone tried the multiplayer yet?

This thread needs more posts!

I’m actually a fan of the “removal” of historical events. Don’t get me wrong, I love the historical accuracy, and I have learned a thing or two from previous Paradox games, but I know I metagame the crap out of them, and that makes it less fun for me. I can’t not take advantage of what I know is coming, because I know it’s coming. This switch actually makes me much more interested in the game. The switch to 3D does not.

Question: How are you going to teach AI to choose between historical event’s outcomes intelligently? Or is it going to be a random generator every time AI faces historical event with multiply choices?

Also does EU3 has different AIs for different major countries, like Paradox did in HOI2?

Just say “no” to metagaming. :) It’s very simple - all you have to do is to never look into events file, and you’ll be fine. Gutting the game of all historical accuracy, which was the heart of the game in my opinion, is not a good solution.

Here is a proposal for Q3 “Slogan Of The Day”: Friends do not let friends metagame. =)

The EU2/HOI2 event engine allowed you to give AI weight to different choices. For example in HOI2, for the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact the AI Soviets are set to only offer an alliance with the Germans 2% of the time. 96% of the time they choose the historical option (I think it has a 2% chance to also tell the Germans to bugger off). Human players can freely choose any of these options, this is only used to direct the AI in which event choices are “correct” but still give a small chance for wackiness.

I didn’t check.

While a nice proposition, it’s not realistically possible. After you’ve played a nation through a campaign you know exactly what will happen, and when. Once you know, there’s no way it won’t affect your decisions. You might make a less than optimal choice because you think it’ll be fun, but you’ll also know that it’s less than optimal.

Also, like Lum said, the AI isn’t intelligent. It’s up to the event designer to balance the probabilities. If you do massive event packs you might want to check the AI nation’s slider priorities so it doesn’t get hit with events that consistantly reverse it’s slider moves, but that’s about all the AI modding you’d need.

I have to say I really like the new interface. The little drop down box in the top left that shows you the status of all your centers of trade, armies, navies, ongoing sieges and battles is a stroke of genius.

The message window leaves a lot to be desired as has been pointed out (it gets blocked by the province and siege windows, also multiplayer chat messages quickly gfet lost in the clutter and all the text is the same colour) but the siege and battle reports are a nice improvment and in genral the messages, notifications, and warnings are well done.

Don’t know how the AI stacks up yet. Map is still godawful but I can live with it. Interesting how the sprites are replaced with counters if you zoom out enough…

Gamespot gave it a 8.7, which is very very good. I’m enjoying it so far (but I haven’t finished a a game yet).

Lorini