I dub Adam the Qt3 luddite. He will be the one throwing his shoes at the DVD assembly line as the industry switches over, shouting “Ten CD’s are cheaper! Ten CD’s are cheaper!”
:P
Well I haven’t played EQ for quite a long time now, and I am blindly aping what I have heard, which is why I am asking. I want to know if it’s true or not, because the answer completely alters my perception as to what the event is truly about. If they have the balls to invite people like Thott, Furor, Rombus, or Itzlegend to talk to them… I applaud.
We will be shipping 2 SKU’s. We would sooner just do DVD’s but penetration is just not there yet :(
Yeah should be able to just copy it to DVD’s etc, we only care about a reg key.
As for performance well we will see how it shakes out when we get into large scale beta :)
It’s hard to believe that you are worried about the DVD penetration when a DVD reader is cheap as fries.
Instead a whole system that will be able to run the game in a decent way doesn’t seem a concern. Perhaps I’m crazy, but I don’t see any logic. In a large scale beta you “meet” the same fanboys geek that have a passion on these games and have always up-to-date monster machines. You don’t meet your general, casual public that makes the difference between a successful product and a failure.
As long as you can dial back the features and it works well, I’m actually pretty okay with that. God knows the original EQ engine only looked current for about 6 months and rapidly went downhill. If they can put in all sorts of insane shader stuff that shows off the game on hardware that’s not out yet, but still make it run smooth and look good on current hardware, more power to them.
However, they fucking well better not advertise with the turned all the way up so that nobody can run it graphics. Advertise with something that’s playable at a good (~20+) framerate on top of the line PCs right now and it’s in line with other games. Stuff that you can get in a screenshot but gives you 2 FPS might look good in ads, but it will only lead to backlash when the game comes out and nobody can run it.
Oh I AM worried about both :)
I wasnt trying to be dismissive of performance issues at all. We care A LOT about running on the lowest end machines we possibly can.
I mentioned large scale beta testing becuase I think its true. For example right now I get a just dandy framerate wandering around Qeynos docks, the impact of several hundred folks walking around that zone like EQ’s Plane of Knowledge will test that system a lot more than we can internally becuase players come up with wacky ways to break our games :)
Well I haven’t played EQ for quite a long time now, and I am blindly aping what I have heard, which is why I am asking. I want to know if it’s true or not, because the answer completely alters my perception as to what the event is truly about. If they have the balls to invite people like Thott, Furor, Rombus, or Itzlegend to talk to them… I applaud.[/quote]
Furor would probably have a bit of a difficulty consulting with them on EQ given that he’s currently employed by Blizzard.
I don’t know if they invited Thott specifically, but I heard Triton had been extended an invitation from a Triton member on one of the ranger boards.
Some other guild also got an invite for their guild leader; I get the impression they’re an uber guild though they’re not one of the ones I know about (FoH, LoS, BotS, Talisman, Triton, Afterlife). Some guild on Inno that, when going to their website, had a pic of the Cragbeast queen on the front page.
I get the feeling they’re serious about this. I’m not sure what to think about them seeking the guidance of uberguilds and fansites instead of just fansites… I think uberguilds are a lot of the reason for what’s wrong in the game. But I’m willing to admit that maybe I’m just missing something. If the uberguilds can get them to quit screwing with classes to the point that I undergo godhood to uselessness in 2 expansions I’m all for it.
As long as you can dial back the features and it works well, I’m actually pretty okay with that. God knows the original EQ engine only looked current for about 6 months and rapidly went downhill. If they can put in all sorts of insane shader stuff that shows off the game on hardware that’s not out yet, but still make it run smooth and look good on current hardware, more power to them.
I think it would be great if more games coded for future systems as long as its made very clear what’s in place for the future and what should be used now. Otherwise you’d have everyone with a top of the line complaining that the game won’t run worth a shit with all the details maxed out.
[quote=“mouselock”]
As long as you can dial back the features and it works well, I’m actually pretty okay with that. God knows the original EQ engine only looked current for about 6 months and rapidly went downhill. If they can put in all sorts of insane shader stuff that shows off the game on hardware that’s not out yet, but still make it run smooth and look good on current hardware, more power to them.
However, they fucking well better not advertise with the turned all the way up so that nobody can run it graphics. Advertise with something that’s playable at a good (~20+) framerate on top of the line PCs right now and it’s in line with other games. Stuff that you can get in a screenshot but gives you 2 FPS might look good in ads, but it will only lead to backlash when the game comes out and nobody can run it.[/quote]
I agree. The live stuff we ran at E3 was on good top end machines and we were not faking anything. Right now one of the biggest ways you can improve EQ2’s frame rate for example is turning off shadows (which are pretty groovy btw), I dont think thats a bait and switch on folks.
Well I haven’t played EQ for quite a long time now, and I am blindly aping what I have heard, which is why I am asking. I want to know if it’s true or not, because the answer completely alters my perception as to what the event is truly about. If they have the balls to invite people like Thott, Furor, Rombus, or Itzlegend to talk to them… I applaud.[/quote]
Furor would probably have a bit of a difficulty consulting with them on EQ given that he’s currently employed by Blizzard.
I don’t know if they invited Thott specifically, but I heard Triton had been extended an invitation from a Triton member on one of the ranger boards.
Some other guild also got an invite for their guild leader; I get the impression they’re an uber guild though they’re not one of the ones I know about (FoH, LoS, BotS, Talisman, Triton, Afterlife). Some guild on Inno that, when going to their website, had a pic of the Cragbeast queen on the front page.
I get the feeling they’re serious about this. I’m not sure what to think about them seeking the guidance of uberguilds and fansites instead of just fansites… I think uberguilds are a lot of the reason for what’s wrong in the game. But I’m willing to admit that maybe I’m just missing something. If the uberguilds can get them to quit screwing with classes to the point that I undergo godhood to uselessness in 2 expansions I’m all for it.[/quote]
Interesting.
Looks like nobody from Luclin got invited, which doesn’t really surprise me due to the fact that the current top 2 guilds have only been there a little while.
Nope. Dialing back spell particles so they’re still nice but not as nice is another way of doing it. And I was emphatic not because I hate sony, but because I hate sleazy advertising. (And knew you haunt these boards so was hoping the message would make it to at least one involved party. ;) )
I do think the level of stutteriness I’ve seen on the live demo runs I’ve seen so far is a bit unacceptable, though. Hope that gets wrung out before it goes live; judging by the time I’ve spent in some of the other testing stuff (most recently EQ1s new engine) I’m willing to believe that you truly are showing code that will still get more optimization/fluidity before it’s a sellable product.
As a rabid consumer who owns a DVD drive, I would most certainly be very hesitant buying a game that comes on 10 CDs. Like, why would I want to punish myself? You probably have a much increased chance of getting bad disk, installation taking a bejeezus long time, and having to find sleeves/jackets/boxes/crates to store the damned thing.
No thanks.
I don’t play EQ anymore, haven’t for well over a year now, but when I did I ran Talisman. I never put Talisman quite on the same pedestal as FoH and Afterlife, but I would put us right underneath them. So no, I don’t run a fansite, just an uberguild page (www.talismanguild.org).
We got an invite to pick any member to send but apparently they just decided on the new GL. They already have a massive thread on the board yammering about what they want him to bring up, all of which was complete greek to me. Amazing how quickly I forgot everything and how much it’s changed.
I think it’s a smart thing for SOE to do. People want to be heard and they have a lot to say, most of which gets lost at a con or on message boards. I know uberguilds get a lot of shit, but I really think most of that is unwarranted. They are also easily the most vocal and knowledgeble people concerning Norrath. Love em or hate em it would be foolish for SOE to ignore them.
Clarification: 2 SKU’s means we will be doing a DVD version and a CD version. We will make sure they are well labelled :)
Sony’s not about to risk limiting its potential audience by making its flagship computer game DVD-only. The hardware base isn’t there yet, and games aren’t yet pushing the CD/DVD barrier hard enough or regularly enough.
Yes, someone’s going to have to test the water’s depth, but I expect you’ll going to see a range of publishers sticking in a branch (a la UT2004) over the next year or so, but only after (or simultaneously with) a CD release.
(And just as a reference point, I don’t see Konami switching to DVD releases in the wake of its Metal Gear Solid: Substance PC-DVD.)
Now, that’s a great idea! :)
Peter
Stack 10 CDs together off a spindle or something. That’s pretty thick. Now stack 20 of them. Now put each into those flimsy paper envelope things. You are not going to get 20 CDs to fit inside the new small profile boxes that games use. You will barely get 10 in there with even a shitty modern manual.
If there was ever a game that would drive people to buy DVD players, EQ2 is it. Especially since it ain’t out yet. Plus look at UT2K4’s sales figures for the DVD version.
But there wasn’t any demand- if you really wanted MGS2 you would already have played it on PS2 or Xbox.
The only way it will work is for it to be a very high profile primarily PC release. Something that people would be willing to upgrade for. Half Life 2, Doom 3, Everquest 2, the next Blizzard game, etc.
I think Everquest is the best platform for it because it already has a large fanbase that’s shown its willing to shell out for montly fees and expansions so what’s a $20 DVD drive? There’s also the peer pressure from the person’s guild or group to upgrade so they can join them in the new game. Then of course there’s the fact that there’s its also technically warranted- none of the other high profile games have anywhere near the same storage requirements.
Alas, it isn’t going to happen. As it is we will likely have to wait for the first major game where the DVD SKU outsells the CD SKU.
They released Final Fantasy XI for $100 since it requires the HD.
The logic about installed the base goes completly against PC gaming. People upgrade all the time with more memmory, faster CPU’s and new video cards to play games. You don’t see id, Valve or others still releasing Quake II era games saying well we don’t want to alienate people.
But there wasn’t any demand- if you really wanted MGS2 you would already have played it on PS2 or Xbox.
[/quote]
Substance was a remake of the first MGS, not the second, and it had much, much improved graphics, as well as all of the engine and control and other enhancements gained in MGS2, as well as a bunch of extra features. It was significantly different from the first MGS.
Well, more to the point, hard-core PC gamers upgrade all the time. I suspect EverQuest’s audience is rather more mainstream. (Good indication: What percentage of users connect to EQ on a 56K modem?)
Don’t get me wrong. I’d wager that most PCs sold now ship with a DVD drive. The base is growing rapidly and I think a switch is inevitable. By fall 2005, it’ll probably be a done deal.
Peter