Thanks a bunch! That helps a lot. Um, Bethesda? Most of us can’t read minds…

How is crafting different than New Vegas? I’m not sure I like what I’m hearing about ‘busywork’. FNV already went a bit too far for me personally in terms of crafting / busywork by introducing so many ammo types and ammo crafting. I never could get into building up a house just to have it look good, and it seems like F4 takes that even further? Witcher 3 has some crafting usability improvements like being able to pin recipes, does F4 improve further?

Rubble and cinderblock.

Huh, I haven’t noticed any pickable examples of either. But maybe I ignored them.

F4 is starting to sour on me a little. By far the biggest issue I am having is that this is supposed to be 200 years after the war and almost nothing looks like it has progressed past 6 months after the war.

I restarted with a different character after reading up a bit on some stuff. I’m loving it now–all the criticisms are pretty much accurate, but most don’t matter much for me. I agree the main story and even most side stories are sub-par, but I like the look of the world and I’ve had a great time just exploring around Sanctuary. This time I 1) saved right before you leave the vault where you get the change your character options, so I can go back and try different things, and 2) didn’t head to “home” right off the bad. I also scarfed all the crap I missed the first time so I have a reasonably stocked supply of crafting materials.

It doesn’t feel as integrated or alive as Skyrim, that’s true. The Elder Scrolls world, though, is a very well developed, time-tested game environment, whereas Fallout is, well, an idea, a general concept, more than anything really well planned or structured. That does hurt, but I am finding the core gameplay–explore, kill, loot, level–to be well done. The UI, yeah, there’s a bolgia in Dante’s hell for people who thought this was good on a PC, but I can forgive that.

Dialog options are limited, and while it’s not something I usually worry about, I can definitely see why folks aren’t digging it here. They’re…simplistic, to say the least. I do think they’re leaving a lot of cool role-playing/narrative options on the table by not fully exploiting the after the holocaust sort of setting, but then again, this isn’t trying to be a novel either. It’s a first-person kill and loot and level and explore game before it’s a story game. Whether that works for people or not is a personal decision.

[table=“width: 500, class: grid”]
[tr]
[td]Dogmeat[/td]
[td]Not Witcher 3[/td]
[td]Fancy Fallout 3 Mod[/td]
[td]S.P.E.C.A.L.[/td]
[td]“Wish I was playing Witcher 3”[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Better gunplay[/td]
[td]“Can’t play this after Witcher 3”[/td]
[td]Console command to increase carry limit[/td]
[td]Cons: No Geralt of Rivia[/td]
[td]Better aesthetic, more color and saturation[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]Kleptomania![/td]
[td]Conversation system lacking[/td]
[td]BINGO[/td]
[td]I have sold my PC after Witcher 3, my gaming days are over[/td]
[td]Lots of diverse locations[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]I can’t have sex on the back of unicorn in Fallout 4[/td]
[td]Settlements and crafting[/td]
[td]“Where is Roach the horse?”[/td]
[td]V.A.T.S. has improved[/td]
[td]Lots of Raiders to shoot[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]U.I. Needs improvement[/td]
[td]“I have sworn a vow of silence until I play a game that is the equal to Witcher 3”[/td]
[td]Huge open world filled with stuff[/td]
[td]U-Grids[/td]
[td]“Has anybody mentioned Witcher 3 yet?”[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]

-Todd

This bugs me too, but it’s always bugged me in Fallout games. They never really, in a narrative or logical sense, fully resolve their issues with balancing game play stuff (finding loot, encountering people, being able to explore) with the whole post-apocalyptic vibe. They seem to want to have both the short-term disruption of society/shock effect, and the long-term resettlement and rebirth of civilization vibe at the same time.

It’s one of the things you just have to roll with with Fallout I think. Lights that still work? Power sources (yeah, it’s atomic, but still) that are going strong? Cheap wooden houses that have endured 200 years plus the aftermath of a nuclear war? I want those contractors to work on my house…

How can you rebuild when the “raider to non-raider” ratio is 9:1?

Is there no way to craft ammo in this game?

Cheap wooden houses that have endured 200 years plus the aftermath of a nuclear war? I want those contractors to work on my house…

While the real answer to this is, “Chill out, it’s a video game”, if you really wanted to get into it you could consider that those houses were built in 2077… so they are almost certainly not built from the same stuff that cheap wooden houses in the 1950’s were built from, even if they look the same.

How can you rebuild when the “raider to non-raider” ratio is 9:1?

Automated machine gun turrets.

Wait. Where’s The Witcher 3 space?

My biggest gripe with the UI is that the back/exit command is so inconsistent. I believe depending on where you are in a menu it can be Tab, Enter, or Esc. Hitting the same key repeatedly won’t get you out of the menu because the key changes. Worst is Esc, because unless the menu explicitly calls for you to use Esc to get out, that key will open the game menu. Infuriating.

Everything is relative.

Let me describe in detail what you do in terms of UI, and where problems may or may not lie. Whether those things will be too busywork like is ultimately up to you of course.

You need raw materials to make shit (duh). You get raw materials from “scrapping” things. There are a couple of ways to do this:

  1. IIRC< you can go into the pip boy, select items from the menu, and press a button to scrap them. This is awful in every possible way. The pipboy is a terrible UI device and you quickly accumulate a ton of shit so there’s lots of scrolling. Busywork? I think so. But it’s just not an elegant want to get what you need. There is an exception use-case which I’ll talk about later.

  2. You can dump all junk into crafting stations, which serve both as crafting stations and storage containers of unusual capacity. I really don’t know if there’s a limit. I believe there is actually a “dump all junk” or somesuch command, so no need to do this one item (or stack of items) at a time. Anyway when it comes time to make all the things, the UI is quite clear about what you need. If you are short on the actual materials (be it copper, concrete, or springs), the crafting station will select some item from the shit you dumped into it and scrap it to get parts it needs. AFAIK it will keep doing this until you are ready to make the thing.

This is actually a really nice piece of UI work. Except Reddit has claimed that when items are scrapped in this manner, you only get whatever it is you needed from them. A watch when scrapped by any other processes (#1 or #3) produces 2 gold, I think 2 sprockets, and a spring. If you needed a spring and the station ate a watch to get it, you would lose the sprockets an gold. This is bad because some of the things items break down into are apparently much more important than others (I am told copper and ceramics are a really big deal). I cannot at this time confirm if this is a problem or someone misunderstood. Further, it could be a bug.

  1. You drop shit on the ground near a crafting station and enter workshop mode. This is done by pressing and holding ‘v’ (not just pressing; that toggles 1st and 3rd person view, ugh) in a “workshop area”, or using a crafting station. “workshop areas” are zones around crafting stations. They’re quite large in some cases (all of the starting slice of suburb that is Savlation or Serenity or whatever they are calling it counts as one eventually). In this mode, you can access various crafting menus to do crafty things. But you can also walk around and highlight almost any object. An option that appears is to press ‘r’ to scrap the item you are highlighting. Boom! Component parts. I think there’s a visual distinction between “junk” (which is anything designed for you to turn into materials) and “this is a thing you built”. Yellow versus green.

You can drop shit on the ground and scrap that way. It’s better than #1 but not preferable to a #2 that always leaves you with every material.

Lastly, there’s another nifty feature in “Workshop mode”. Maybe you want to make power generators. Who doesn’t! they power things. It’s great. Anyway, the materials list will appear and show you - not quite as distinctly as it ought but never mine - an X/Y list of “how much you have/how much is needed”. The items you are short on appear slightly dimmer. I can’t recall the exact UI interactions, but you can essentially elect to put items into a search list. What this in turn does is put a little magnifying glass next to any item that breaks down into a component or components on your search list. So if you go look into a chest of drawers where you stored a bunch of shit, when scrolling trhough the list you can easily tell “oh, they, this has something I need”. But not what it has. Also this icon appears I think when you are trading with people and randomly wandering the wasteland and looting. This is a nice feature though the list needs to be curated. It’s the only time I would go into the inventory and look for junk to break down.

Some additional problems crop up with the UI. Some things require a confirm dialog that we could argue ought not to. Quitting a crafting station, e.g. (this problem is further exacerbated because Tab “backs out” of menu levels, essentially sending you to the top of the tree one press at a time. But pressing it at the top invokes the quit confirmation in crafting screens; another tab press cancels teh quit confirmation and returns you to the top level crafting menu). You have to confirm scrapping when using method #3, which is understandable on paper. Maybe you dropped a bunch of shit on the ground that is not junk but you want to scrap some. Or sort it. Or whatever. The confirmation to scrap, though, makes scrapping in that manner more tedious. Which makes clearing up #2 all the more important.

And then there’s the fact that Bethesda has spent exactly 24 seconds explaining the entirety of the game mechanics introduced in the first few hours of gameplay. Yeah, some of it is familiar. Some of it is not. Exiting power armor, for example, is a totally new thing and requires pressing and holding ‘E’/Enter, which are ordinarily the “confirm/go deeper into a menu hierarchy” buttons. Haha! Also the afformentioned “wait, I need to correct generators and powered things with wires. Where are the wires again?” scenario.

I think it would be perfectly reasonable for people to find method #3 a bit involved/busy work even without scrapping (you still have to go drop what is potentially a lot of junk). If you are a “if it’s not bolted down pick it up” sort of person, you will be filling up on junk somewhat rapidly and need to dump it somewhere.

Genocide.

Yes, this is true. Exiting crafting should just be “tab out of the top level, done!”, no confirm. Just like how the pip boy works. I would do the same for trading if it’s not being done already. This would solve a lot of problems.

Maybe because I played FO3 and FNV with M+K, but how has VATS improved?

When I uses VATS with the controller, I’m pressing a shoulder button to enter the system, then right trigger to pick my spot, and then a button to actually shoot.

I felt like that was just clunky as hell. Made me wish I was playing M+K in the combat, that’s for sure.

The good news is that regular aiming and shooting is actually an effective way of playing Fallout 4.

The bad news is that VATS is pretty much useless, except as a handy way to highlight enemies.

All Fallout games (especially 3 onwards) have had this problem.

Didn’t realize that firing from cover was implemented. I’ll have to test it after work:

https://www.reddit.com/r/fo4/comments/3se2gv/friendly_reminder_on_how_to_fire_from_cover_in/

The regular gunplay definitely is better. It’s not a full-on shooter, but it’s smoother, faster and generally more competent than FO3/ NV. I still use VATS, though. For example, when Ferals are closing in, I concentrate fire on a leg. Once they drop, Dogmeat can finish them off. Saves bullets.

Random Tip: You can salvage mods from weapons you find or buy. I found a suppressed pipe pistol very early on. I crafted a new muzzle for it, which made the pipe-gun suppressor available for my rifle.