1601

I don’t know. The ‘rough ride’ hypothesis in this NYT story seems plausible. A guy with his feet fettered and hands tied behind his back can’t catch himself from smashing into the walls on intentional hard turns. This practice has already led to several prisoners ending up paralyzed:

The tradition was regarded as a technique by aggressive officers to inflict punishment on those they arrested without ever being accused of physically assaulting them with their weapons or hands. For a suspect with hands cuffed behind him, seated on a thin bench in the back of a speeding police van, a sudden stop or a sharp turn or a bumpy road can cause severe injuries that can leave a person in a wheelchair or disfigured for life.

At least two other Baltimore men, Jeffrey Alston and Dondi Johnson, were paralyzed after police van rides in separate cases that led to lawsuits. Mr. Alston, paralyzed from the neck down, settled for $6 million in 2004.

It would be an effective way to punish while maintaining plausible deniability that is was intentional.

1602

This isn’t just a “white police force”. Something 55% (I think?) white, with a black chief of police. I think in this case it is more of a way of doing things, an attitude if you will. Us vs Them.

1603

I figure David Simon knows a thing or two about Baltimore police: https://www.themarshallproject.org/2015/04/29/david-simon-on-baltimore-s-anguish

1604

I REALLY hope that this is a charge based on hard evidence and not just a politically driven prosecution. The speed makes me wonder, especially with all of the crap going on there, but maybe it is an airtight case. It certainly sounds like someone along the line probably did “something,” but that alone isn’t enough to convict someone.

1605

Yeah, but it’s enough to charge them with a crime.

1606

It doesn’t take weeks to charge ordinary people with a crime. It shouldn’t take weeks to charge these police officers with a crime. There’s more than enough evidence for probable cause, so it’s perfectly reasonable for the 6 officers to already be charged with various crimes.

That’s the entire point, and what was so despicable about the other atrocities in the last few years.

No one is saying that the 6 police officers are proven guilty, just like no one claimed that Darren Wilson was proven guilty of murdering Michael Brown. All that people wanted was the acknowledgement that, given identical circumstances, if they weren’t police officers, there would have absolutely been charges filed without waiting for that long.

1607

If I go kill someone, they wont wait long to press charges. They’ll probably do it within 15 minutes.

1608

If you go out and intentionally kill some one they’ll charge you almost immediately if there is enough evidence because they want to get a danger to the public off the streets. If someone in your care dies and it’s unclear whether it’s neglect, malefic intent or an accident - you’re a nurse; you’re a daycare provider; you’re a taxicab driver - it can take weeks or months before the DA feels they have enough evidence to charge you.

I also feel that they should have moved more swiftly on this, but I don’t think the delay is TOO inconsistent with second-degree murder charges elsewhere. What’s worrisome is that it took a couple weeks to suspend the officers and actually start looking into whether or not there was something suspicious in Gray’s death… which should have been obvious from the start.

1609

Well, part of the problem is that police have many more protections than us when being investigated. That can take time, especially with six people involved.

1610

Thanks for linking that. Simon is always worth listening to.

1611

That’s inaccurate. Unless they find you with a smoking gun and/or you confess on the spot, you’re not likely to be charged right away – especially when they’re not even sure it was homicide. Thursday I heard a neurosurgeon saying on the radio that, in his professional opinion, the injury clearly happened before the guy even was in the in van. Then the next morning homicide charges are filed against all 6 officers, including officers who weren’t there when this guy thinks the injury occurred.

I’m not defending the DA in this case – I think they moved too slowly, too – but it’s just wrong to say that charges don’t take weeks. In most cases, when they’re not sure if it was a homicide, they do take a long, long time.

No one is saying that the 6 police officers are proven guilty, just like no one claimed that Darren Wilson was proven guilty of murdering Michael Brown. All that people wanted was the acknowledgement that, given identical circumstances, if they weren’t police officers, there would have absolutely been charges filed without waiting for that long.

Again, just based on anecdotal experience, I don’t think that’s the case. That said, it’s a damn good thing they filed charges in this case, and will be taking it to trial – which is all anyone wanted with Darren Wilson, too.

1612

‘Freddie Gray: legal volunteers arrested after defying Baltimore curfew’:

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/may/03/freddie-gray-legal-volunteers-arrested-after-defying-baltimore-curfew

Legal observers and medical volunteers were among the roughly 50 people arrested in Baltimore on Saturday night, as another evening of protests ended in yet more clashes as protesters attempted to defy curfew restrictions.

Two volunteers, who identified themselves as belonging to the National Lawyers Guild, were seen by the Guardian being arrested alongside four street medics outside the Baltimore City Correctional Center.

One of the legal observers was wearing a bright green cap, emblazoned with her organisation’s name – caps which have proven useful for protesters seeking legal advice during this past week.

1613

As an example of failed policies: 130 million dollars was put into Freddie Gray’s neighborhood to redevelop it during the 90s. All to no discernable effect.

1614

This isn’t just an issue of bad spending, there are also systemic issues. The problem can be all of the above.

1615

President Obama to announce equipment restrictions for the police.

The federal government will no longer provide heavy military equipment like tanks and grenade launchers to local cops following weeks of backlash against officers who confronted protesters in Ferguson, Missouri, in armored vehicles and camouflage last year, President Barack Obama will announce Monday.

And if they want other, less-imposing military equipment, local law enforcement agencies will have to submit to stringent federal oversight and restrictions, according to guidelines Obama will outline during a visit to discuss police reform in Camden, New Jersey

1616

What?! I won’t feel safe if the local cops aren’t packing RPG’s!

1617

Honestly, this is kind of pointless, since the issue the police have isn’t that they are too heavily armed.

1618

It’s not pointless. The issue is that citizens feel that police are antagonizing them rather than protecting them. A direct contributor to this perception is the use of equipment intended for military occupation.

1619

Timex, I disagree. I think I explained it in another thread, but equipment has a very big influence in how you train. If you have an APC, you train to use it, and that means a certain amount of police nuance is lost. You don’t even disembark from an APC the same way you would an SUV/car. Little things like that add up and it’s easy to fall into a military peacekeeping mindset which is very different from a police “protect and serve” way of thinking.

1620

The whole “if you’re a hammer, all you see is nails” thing. Which can definitely be true. If your department is full of military gear, you start to see people as “enemies” to fight against rather than citizens to defend. That’s what we saw in Ferguson.