Okay. I’ll bite.
So here is something not specific. We allow rat droppings in most of our food items, a very small amount, due to the way warehouses and factories are maintained. It’s just not realistic to expect 0 from that in our food source.
If someone hands you a spoonful of rat droppings, don’t eat it just because a miniscule amount is found in our daily intake. Also, if there is a pile of it, don’t go around doing rat dropping angels either.
So you’d agree that it’s a matter of extent, and that poop on its own isn’t necessarily a reason to delay hundreds of people for hours and all the knock-on consequences.
No. I would say that just because we don’t have a 100% cleanliness doesn’t mean animal shit on the floor, seat and walls on a plane is okay. In fact, it’s the opposite of okay. It’s hazardous. And I thought we were avoiding specifics.
Look, dude, you claimed above that it was the customer’s “job” to clean animal shit off of a seat he probably spent hundreds of dollars on (or his company did). You’re either trolling us, or just have a weird idea of how being a customer works.
Just quit the field on this one. As Nesrie suggested above, I don’t get why you’re digging in your heels on this. They were wrong. That’s that.
Move on. Keep posting in this thread, by all means, but let it go.
-xtien
We are! I think :). One of my points is we have no reliable information about the extent, other than a picture of the bottom of a shoe and a statement. One piece of evidence is the statement and picture, the other evidence which I forwarded is that the flight continued and the passenger elected to put up with it. They point to different possible ‘levels of poop’, to which we’ve drawn a different conclusion.
In a sense, I will allow that the extreme version (which I feel is the sensationalized version and not likely true) would, if true, warrant a delay to the flight. I’m wondering if you’ll allow that my version that it was a small enough issue to not warrant delay (which you think is untrue) could at least be supportable, if it were true.
Can we at least laugh at the debate as to whether or not some dog poo is acceptable (clearly I’m not alone thinking that it is, though maybe you think none is acceptable)?
This is not correct at all
Delta pulled the plane out of service to clean and disinfect it. That’s two pieces… the two that are involved.
Yes. I think no amount of dog shit is acceptable on an airplane seat, or wall, or walkway, just as I think no amount of dog shit is okay in a grocery store…or for that matter in my house.
And I’m a proud dog owner.
No amount is acceptable for a customer to deal with himself. I don’t understand why you don’t get that.
This is such a weird stance.
-xtien
Poop is funny.
That’s science.
And scientists can’t figure out what’s funnier, poop or penises.
Fair enough, that is also pointing to the level of the problem. Maybe I’m just more one to prefer the flight leaves with a cleaned-up but still present dog-poo stain, while other prefer to have the flight delayed and/or airplane swapped which can take a long time.
You have no idea what people think about a stain on the seat. That’s not what happened, at all. You just keep making stuff up to sound less crazy. We’re not talking about stains on the seat or toothbrushes. You are.
Part of the problem is projection of intentions. You assume I’m arguing that it’s acceptable for dog poop on flights, I’m not. I’m saying that in a particular situation, a decision has to be made about proceeding or stopping. They chose to proceed and I’m defending that.
Tangentially related - a flight delay can have real downstream consequences in addition to cost. It’s not just Delta being cheap, it’s the passengers trying to make connections, life events, etc.
Ugh, back into details. Maybe I can just be silenced by majority opinion here, seems the only path out.
You’re the only one who tried to say you weren’t going to talk about the specifics and take a break and then you did neither of those things. No one is silencing you. You’re position makes no sense.
I hope you don’t work in healthcare, around food, around children or the elderly, all those places of services would be shut down if you continuously had loose stools all over your establishment, and it’s not because no else brushes their teeth.
Delta even disagrees with you. They didn’t just send a crew in to clean the plane on landing; they took it out of service. That’s how serious it is. You just want to make this seem like it’s not a big deal. It is a big deal.
This is a good point. About the projection of intentions. That’s not a fair thing to do, and not useful in an argument. So I apologize for doing that here.
That said, you did say that the customer’s “job” was to clean off his own seat, didn’t you? I don’t understand that stance. The previous customer, the one who brought the sick dog who shat up the place…that person should have cleaned up. Definitely their job. But given this was probably an “emotional support animal” I’m imagining they couldn’t handle that task.
All that said, and with an understanding of what you say about intentions, I still don’t get this:
I find it indefensible. Yes. I get that there are economic consequences. Delays and a ton of problems for other travelers. But we’ve decided to let animals on planes without really regulating that, so I opt for safety, even with delays. You defend the corporation who puts people at risk. I don’t get it.
There is risk in everything we do. I drive about four hours a day. That’s way more risky than flying. But I take on that risk and make it as safe as I can. They did not do their due diligence in that regard.
-xtien
Go ask a cruise ship operator what’s more important: on-time departure or disinfecting biohazardous material. Because when you decide the former, what you get is norovirus outbreaks. And that is much worse than delaying some cruise passengers.
I think this is an exaggeration and a projection of intentions. You’re saying I wouldn’t object to loose dog poop in a food preparation area - that’s crazy.
I find your post more reasonable, thanks! You see it as an unacceptable risk. That’s a fair position. Maybe they got lucky that there were no further issues / illnesses?
Risk vs cost is what it comes down to I guess. When we leave for a long drive, we naturally make a similar calculation that the risk (small chance of accident) is worth the benefit (whatever we’re doing at the end). Seems someone (the pilot?) decided the risk was worth the benefit here.
I didn’t say the kitchen. It’s probably in the dining room where you hand out paper towels and tell the customers to just wipe it off or it will slow your staff down.
Norovirus infects human cells and is transmitted via human poop. I don’t think there are any documented cases of norovirus transmission from a dog to a human. Or any other virus, with the notable exception of rabies.
And nearly all animal poop is less dangerous to humans than the human poop often found smeared on airplane lavatory seats. Which, of course, shares the same air circulation as the rest of the aircraft…
Finally, Nesrie already brought up the rat poop we unintentionally eat. But if you eat shrimp without deveining them, then you intentionally eat shrimp poop. In some places, animal poop is even used as a building material!
Don’t even get started on the coffee beans that get pooped out by Asian civets.
I think if we get about 15 more this thread will have 100 posts on the subject of shit.