6516

They crossed it years ago, it just became a lot harder to deny it after today.

6517

So who on this forum would quit their job and go camp out on the Mall for the foreseeable future? If not now, what would it take to change the answer to ‘yes’? Who here has a spouse and/or kids to explain it to?

It probably really is easier to have ‘storming The Bastille’ type revolutions in countries where a major chunk of the population is concentrated in a centrally located capital that is seldom more than a couple hundred miles from anywhere else and is both the political and cultural center of said country.

My Czech friend made the Prague Spring kinda sound like a big party. If you already live there it’s just a question of going downstairs and maybe taking a metro hop. And if you’re a student you don’t have to risk your job, you can just cut class.

6518

They’re agreeing to a vote. Because they can’t really stop it. The best they can do right now is try to have the vote after the SOTU speech on Tuesday.

And the vote they’re agreeing to will be a vote that will acquit the President. Because Mitch McConnell has informed Chuck Schumer that conviction will be at least 13 votes short.

When the vote takes place, at least 44 Democrats, perhaps up to 47, will vote to convict. Schumer may tell Manchin and Doug Jones that they’re clear to vote for acquittal if it helps them in West Virginia and Alabama respectively.

6519

it’s the right decision politically, but I am kind of tired of American politics being one of endless go-nowhere Great Compromises where nobody takes responsibility on principle and kicks the can down the road until there’s a catastrophic collapse.

6520

Again, it’s not a compromise. If it were, the vote would be Monday or Tuesday. And McConnell may even be able to force a vote by then regardless.

I mean, they’re going to vote. Impeachment trial is over after today’s vote to not call witnesses. It’s a wrap.

6521

No I meant allow Democrats to compromise with their districts and vote against it. Having a vote where only 40 or so Democrats vote to convict looks an awful lot like vindication to Republican voters. The voices that cautioned that it was all a charade will be proven right, and there’s a good chance that the Democrats will have much less ability to prevent a continuous abuse of power being used against them. Instead they look toward a few “districts” and decide - in a Senate they probably can’t hope to win back - to compromise principle for political expediency.

6522

If it’s going nowhere, I’d rather have Doug Jones’s and Joe Manchin’s votes on healthcare in the Senate. The best chance for Dems to take back control of the Senate in 2020 (and it’s not a great chance) is for Doug Jones to win a full term in Alabama.

And honestly, that may be the only chance, if Trump wins, to block him up on what may be four SCOTUS bench appointments before 2024.

6523

Manchin isn’t up till 2024, but if letting him walk makes him easier to keep within the Caucus on other stuff, let the man walk.

This thing was over before it began.

Folks need to move on.

All that matters is 270 electoral votes and 51 Democratic US Senators. Everything else is a distraction.

6524

I get that, but sometimes it isn’t politics as usual and this feels like one of those times. If instead of Trump abusing the Federal Government’s authority to attack his political enemies, it was sending Jews to camps, I’d rather my party stand and (perhaps) fall fighting against the injustice than worrying about if they can keep a few seats so as to get some assistance in the Rhineland hospitals.

As I’ve said before the Democrats will never, in our lifetimes, appoint a Supreme Court justice again as long as the Senate remains Republican, so i’m not worried about that.

6525

Mostly it’s just the insufferableness of the “bipartisan acquittal” we’re going to hear no end of.

6526

Do you want the Senate to remain Republican for our lifetimes?

6527

I think a better option for the Dems would be to all walk out on the vote, and say it’s a sham and the only way to save Democracy is to vote the traitors out.

Another option would be for the House to call Parnas and Bolton, then re-impeach. You get same result, but move evidence comes out. At least declare a 2nd inquiry.

Also, the House should censure the President and Moscow Mitch.

6528

Let’s hope somebody sues him for libel so that he has to testify under oath.

6529

In the odd chance that we have a Republican President with both sides of Congress Democrats, the Republican President will just never name a replacement. About this issue i’m 100% cynical - no Republican will ever allow any Democratic political influence ever again over the Supreme Court in any way. Only if all three branches are Democrats will Democratic judges able to be appointed.

If you think we have a decent chance of winning the Presidency and the Senate, well, fair enough then.

6530

Hard for me to wrap my mind around the likely fact that the Senate is basically about to commit institutional suicide.

6531

So is this all just paranoid thinking or plausible?

So between the republicans complete unwillingness to do the right thing, people like mitch mcConnell being completely uninterested in any kind of election security measures, etc - do people think it’s possible they are planning something big for the 2020 election? Massive fraud / voter suppression to insure trump and republicans win?

Obviously there are still people in government who are not loyal to trump, but are there enough to put a stop to a republican plot to keep control of the country? When the president, attorney general, leader of the senate are all complete pieces of shit, along with plenty of people why are complicit with them, are there enough people to stop them?

6532

Yes, once Trump gets acquitted, the spin from the right is going to be nauseating.

6533

Nope, he’s going to die of malnutrition in a GOP camp.

6534

Does the “oath” word matter anymore? Perjury = pardon.

6535

It’s been my worry all along, so no surprise to say that I don’t think you’re being paranoid. I personally believe that Russia’s influence goes far beyond Trump and they’ve likely channeled lot of money through organizations like the NRA. I also don’t think it was only the DNC that Russia was able to hack/get access to. Maybe they have a lot of dirt on key Republicans, I don’t know.

All I do know is that the Republicans are a shrinking minority party and every election they step up their attacks on fair elections. Gerrymandering districts, voter suppression of multiple kinds, and now openly defending a President who is colluding with foreign governments to help him win re-election.

So do I think you’re being paranoid to be worrying about what the Republicans and other bad actors have in store for 2020? No. No, I do not.