Fun With Satellite Dishes and Apartment Complexes

I’m having a bit of fun with my leasing office at the moment over the placement of my satellite dish. I think I have the situation under control, but I wanted to share the fun here and see if anyone had any ideas I might not have thought of.

I live in a second-floor apartment with a patio. It consider it a nice place, if a bit overpriced. I’ve been there for 7 years, and it’s relatively quiet, and everything generally works. The leasing office staff seems to change every two months, but since I rarely have to deal with them, it’s not a major issue.

A few years ago, my complex decided to sign an exclusive cable deal with a small, local provider. Their service left much to be desired. For digital cable, the picture was kind of lousy, and when I called to ask about HD programming, they said they didn’t even have a timetable on it. A year or so later, I got tired of paying $50 for basic cable and decided to look into Directv (I even started a thread here about it).

I talked to the leasing office about mounting options, and they showed me some photos of what was “compliant” vs “non-compliant.” I decided to take the plunge, did my best to stick to the guidelines, and showed the setup to my leasing office. They said I was fine. For two years, through a multitude of new employees, I’ve never had a complaint about it. And, I love directv. I have Sunday Ticket and all sorts of HD service and would rather move than go back to regular cable.

Last week, I arrived home to find a red note pinned to my door, signaling an “Illegal Satellite Installation.” On the form, there were several possible reasons listed, but none were checked off. Someone had simply written in “lower or remove satellite dish.”

However, at the same time that I arrived home, I found my leasing office manager waiting for me, wanting to talk about the dish. She explained that she was currently getting a lot of pressure from her corporate office (my complex is one of many owned by the same company) to crack down on satellite dish placement, and she’d been specifically asked to place the note on my door, even though she believed the placement of my dish was compliant. She asked if I would be willing to slide my dish further into my patio for a day, so maybe things would blow over, and I agreed. I moved my dish Friday morning, slid it back into place Friday night, and that was the last I heard until today.

This morning, around 8:30, my service vanished. Out on my patio was one of the maintenance staff with a POWER SAW. He was just finshing up cutting part of the center pole in my tripod, after having been asked by the leasing staff to go onto my patio and physically lower my dish. He had indeed lowered the dish, cutting off all reception.

As far as I’m concerned, this is complete BS on almost every level:

  • I followed the guidelines set by my leasing office; they agreed it was compliant when it was installed; and they haven’t complained in two years.
  • The notice I was given last week did not spell out any specific policy that I was violating, just “we want you to lower your dish.”
  • My leasing office manager stated to me directly that she thought my dish placement was compliant.
  • Although my leasing office says they tried to contact me Tuesday, no one successfully got a hold of me before going on to my patio and essentially vandalizing my setup and effective disconnecting my satellite service Wednesday morning.

Ultimately, I don’t want to make a huge deal about this. I want to restablish my service and not be bothered about it again. Before I can do that, however, I need to settle things with these clowns so I don’t have to worry about people climbing on my patio and playing games every day. At this point, I’m already talking to a regional property manager, but apparently both her supervisor and the CEO of the entire company were both at my place and decided my dish was “noncompliant,” which resulted in today’s activities.

Personally, I think I have the inside track on getting this resolved to my satisfaction, no matter what the CEO or property supervisors want, simply due to the poor manner in which its been handled. My guess is they’ve broken about a dozen codes in the way they’ve handled this. But I’m curious if anyone else has had experience with this sort of thing:

  • Can a leasing office change rules overnight? Or does there have to be some period of time where people are asked to comply with new rules, such as implementing stricter rules on dish placement?

  • Does a leasing office have to give some sort of official notice of action that will be taken? Can they just send someone on my patio to vandalize my setup without proper communication?

  • Let’s say this drags on a week. Can I bill them for any lost service?

Anything else I’d want to consider? Having once worked in customer service, I’m obsessive when it comes to documenting conversations and continually pressuring people up the chain, but I get the feeling these guys are going to be hardasses about this, and am looking to build up all the ammo I can get.

He was just finshing up cutting part of the center pole in my tripod, after having been asked by the leasing staff to go onto my patio and physically lower my dish. He had indeed lowered the dish, cutting off all reception.

Hahahahahha. IANAL, but they can’t send someone into an apartment you lease and destroy your property. Sue them. Small claims court. Easy win.

You might also want to call DirectTV and ask them of they have an legal advice deal with this issue. I am sure they do since its a war out there.

DeepT, that’s an awesome idea. thx.

What’s that Eric Wolpaw quote about “Suing, and lots of it?”

Sympathies, as there are few things worse than suddenly losing TV (which really says something for how good most of us have it). But I can’t believe you’re not furious about this. You’ve been a good tenant (presumably) for seven years, and your landlord basically breaks into your place and damages your property? I’d have called the cops immediately and had criminal charges laid for breaking and entering and vandalism. I’d follow that with a civil suit for damages.

And then get the fuck out of the apartment ASAP. Why would you want to continue to give your money to these scumbags? This is absolutely appalling treatment.

Sympathies, as there are few things worse than suddenly losing TV (which really says something for how good most of us have it). But I can’t believe you’re not furious about this. You’ve been a good tenant (presumably) for seven years, and your landlord basically breaks into your place and damages your property? I’d have called the cops immediately and had criminal charges laid for breaking and entering and vandalism. I’d follow that with a civil suit for damages.

And then get the fuck out of the apartment ASAP. Why would you want to continue to give your money to these scumbags? This is absolutely appalling treatment.

I’ve gotten a few notices regarding my dish and that it needs to be more complient (basically, it needs to be able to stand on its own without leaning on the patio fence) and threaten to take it down but aside from the warnings they haven’t done anything about it.

In general, all of the stuff you’ve asked about will be spelled out in your lease.

That being said, it’s a typical feature of most leases that they have to inform you in writing of any changes to policy and give you some period of time to comply (typically one rental period, aka a month)

That being said, a few thoughts:

  1. Get stuff in writing. Rental companies are fucks, depending on the market in your area the worst case scenario for them is that you move in and three days later they rent the place to someone else (probably at a higher price too). Don’t accept the staff saying something is OK - get them to write something down and sign it.
  2. Seriously you are being way too rational about this. I realize that all you want is your TV back but being nice ain’t gonna cut it. You should be angry - demanding restitution, threatening to take them to court. Calling the cops when you found the guy hacking up your stuff would have been a good place to start - probably wouldn’t actually result in charges but the police report alone would put the fear into 'em. That way when you finally agree that you can just let bygone be bygones and get it guaranteed in writing that your dish placement is acceptable they’re thinking “Boy we sure got away light” on that one.

Good luck, and let us know how this turns out!

I once got a notice that my dish was noncompliant. Which was interesting, because I’ve never had one. It was addressed to me personally and everything.

I once lived in a 2 bedroom apartment. There were three of us. I built a wall in the middle of the living room in order to turn half of it into a third bedroom. When the landlord unexpectedly dropped by, I was a bit worried about how soon I’d be evicted and how much of my deposit I’d lose.

His response?

“Cool, now I can charge for a three-bedroom apartment whenever you guys move out.”

Dude I know just built a wall in the living room of his loft… out of six doors bolted together. He bolted them to the hardwood floor. Only the one on the end opens.

No they can’t, not without proper notice. Don’t know about pulling the suing trigger just yet, but that was an improper entry if they did not give you at least a day or so notice. Perhaps it was in the fine print of the noncompliance notice?

FCC info sheet: http://www.fcc.gov/mb/facts/otard.html. Particularly relevant portions bolded.

As directed by Congress in Section 207 of the Telecommunications Act of 1996, the Federal Communications Commission adopted the Over-the-Air Reception Devices (“OTARD”) rule concerning governmental and nongovernmental restrictions on viewers’ ability to receive video programming signals from direct broadcast satellites (“DBS”), broadband radio service providers (formerly multichannel multipoint distribution service or MMDS), and television broadcast stations (“TVBS”).

The rule (47 C.F.R. Section 1.4000) has been in effect since October 1996, and it prohibits restrictions that impair the installation, maintenance or use of antennas used to receive video programming. The rule applies to video antennas including direct-to-home satellite dishes that are less than one meter (39.37") in diameter (or of any size in Alaska), TV antennas, and wireless cable antennas. The rule prohibits most restrictions that: (1) unreasonably delay or prevent installation, maintenance or use; (2) unreasonably increase the cost of installation, maintenance or use; or (3) preclude reception of an acceptable quality signal.

Effective January 22, 1999, the Commission amended the rule so that it also applies to rental property where the renter has an exclusive use area, such as a balcony or patio.

Q: Does the rule apply to residents of rental property?

A: Yes. Effective January 22, 1999, renters may install antennas within their leasehold, which means inside the dwelling or on outdoor areas that are part of the tenant’s leased space and which are under the exclusive use or control of the tenant. Typically, for apartments, these areas include balconies, balcony railings, and terraces. For rented single family homes or manufactured homes which sit on rented property, these areas include the home itself and patios, yards, gardens or other similar areas. If renters do not have access to these outside areas, the tenant may install the antenna inside the rental unit. Renters are not required to obtain the consent of the landlord prior to installing an antenna in these areas. The rule does not apply to common areas, such as the roof or the exterior walls of an apartment building. Generally, balconies or patios that are shared with other people or are accessible from other units are not considered to be exclusive use areas.

Q: Are there restrictions that may be placed on residents of rental property?

A: Yes. A restriction necessary to prevent damage to leased property may be reasonable. For example, tenants could be prohibited from drilling holes through exterior walls or through the roof. However, a restriction designed to prevent ordinary wear and tear (e.g., marks, scratches, and minor damage to carpets, walls and draperies) would likely not be reasonable provided the antenna is installed wholly within the antenna user’s own exclusive use area. In addition, rental property is subject to the same protection and exceptions to the rule as owned property. Thus, a landlord may impose other types of restrictions that do not impair installation, maintenance or use under the rule. The landlord may also impose restrictions necessary for safety or historic preservation.

Q: What restrictions are permitted if the antenna must be on a very tall mast to get a signal?

A: If you have an exclusive use area that is covered by the rule and need to put your antenna on a mast, the local government, community association or landlord may require you to apply for a permit for safety reasons if the mast extends more than 12 feet above the roofline. If you meet the safety requirements, the permit should be granted. Note that the Commission’s rule only applies to antennas and masts installed wholly within the antenna user’s exclusive use area. Masts that extend beyond the exclusive use area are outside the scope of the rule. For installations on single family homes, the “exclusive use area” generally would be anywhere on the home or lot and the mast height provision is usually most relevant in these situations. For example, if a homeowner needs to install an antenna on a mast that is more than 12 feet taller than the roof of the home, the homeowners’ association or local zoning authority may require a permit to ensure the safety of such an installation, but may not prohibit the installation unless there is no way to install it safely. On the other hand, if the owner of a condominium in a building with multiple dwelling units needs to put the antenna on a mast that extends beyond the balcony boundaries, such installation would generally be outside the scope and protection of the rule, and the condominium association may impose any restrictions it wishes (including an outright prohibition) because the Commission rule does not apply in this situation.

Q: Who do I call if my town, community association or landlord is enforcing an invalid restriction?

A: Call the Federal Communications Commission at (888) CALLFCC (888-225-5322), which is a toll-free number, or 202-418-7096, which is not toll-free. Some assistance may also be available from the direct broadcast satellite company, broadband radio service provider, television broadcast station, or fixed wireless company whose service is desired.

You know, I actually have a copy of that OTARD rule sitting around with the paperwork for my dish and forgot all about it.

You guys rock.

Let loose the Bill D inside of you, sluggo. Let’em have it.

So, I called Directv, told them my story, and asked if they had a legal advice dept. They xferred me to another extension, put me on hold for 8 minutes … and then offered to send someone out to relocate my dish for $50.

ROFL.

It was a good idea, but it doesn’t seem that they have a legal advice dept. If they do, and anyone has a number, post away.

Yeah, sue them. IANAL but I like anal, you got to check if there is a provision in the lease that allows them to technically trespass (reaching over into your balcony counts AFAIK, and having a handyman come into your space without your permission - unless that is in the lease agreement, in that they can enter your residence without your permission - is trespassing + destruction of private property and theft/attempted theft). I mean, if they want to argue that stupid note is implied forced permission or something.

Also, you can make your stupid landlady squirm because she’ll be put on the spot where she fucking belongs for telling you she disagreed with her management’s decision. Oh, that’ll be a pip.

EDIT: pay the fifty and add it to the damages you’re suing for.

Yeah. Normally, landlords can put a whole bunch of restrictions into a lease, and you’re bound by those restrictions for the duration (for example, no pets, no smoking). If you want to keep your lease, that is.

But in this case, the law says it is unlawful for a landlord to restrict satellite dish operation if it prevents you from getting a signal. So, don’t let them use that argument against you.

Call the FCC! :-)

I didn’t think you could waive the requirement to give permission to enter.

Technically, they never entered my apartment proper. My satellite dish is on an outdoor patio – they simply climbed up with a ladder and cut the center pole.

I’m not saying that makes it OK; just clarifying for the sake of the thread.