This IS the spoiler thread. For people that read the books.

Should I make a new thread for spoilery discussions?

I think this year’s was late, by a day. Our Whole Foods did not have it Saturday, but I read about a local bar having a release party for it tonight. FWIW, I did not really like the first two and did not try last year’s at all.

If you had bothered to read it, you would see that I didn’t make any specific comments at all. Though frankly, given the several million downloads of the leaked shows at this point, I think you’ll have to adjust your expectations about the Internet and spoilers. Others are not going to be as kind as I am.

I’m not on the general internet - I’m on Qt3 where we usually uphold a certain standard. Its also usually frowned upon to pirate things, which is what the leaked 4 episodes amount to. Pirating.

I did not “bother to read it” as I wrote, because the moment you started to write about your experiences with the leaked episodes, I had to try and get past your post. How fun is that?

All I ask is that you respect that not everyone wants to be a pirate and download the episodes illegally - is that so hard to agree to?

Very well said. I agree completely.

Getting back to Episode 1 - some commentary:

  1. Thank god they cut out Tyrion’s ‘Where do whores go?’ obsession. That was a bit of meandering that the show was well off to edit out.
  2. The googly eyes in the funeral rites are hella distracting
  3. Where the heck is Sansa going that she is out of Cersei’s reach? Some signs would point to Winterfell, but there is no way I see Littlefinger giving the heir to Winterfell to the vampires of the Dreadfort.
  4. Shame to see Mance’s screentime be so short - he was a great character and a great actor. Nature of the medium, though.
  5. Loras needs to be turning his military charms on to Tommen, not flashing his wares to his sister.
  6. Dany covering up in bed was off - real lovers don’t do that.

Prophecy

The flashback and prophecy were incomplete . . . but could be completed later or the other little bits of that prophecy and the events there could have been trimmed for time. (Moderate book spoiler - Cersei’s companion girl also had a reading, and that reading came true, lending weight that Cersei’s prophecy was also accurate)

All in all, a moderately slow start to the season - even with the death of one King.

Didn’t the actress throw down on the two producers that she was sick of the excessive nude scenes she’d performed in the first three seasons?

That is certainly the rumor - http://www.idigitaltimes.com/daenerys-nudity-emilia-clarke-wont-allow-any-more-khaleesi-naked-scenes-game-thrones-season-4-video

I know it took me out of the show and into the story above . . . They could have blocked the scene like this, though - http://www.tootlafrance.ie/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/2335598-ole-ole.jpg?w=584 - and it would have seemed more natural. /Shrug - just nitpicking.

Goofy eye are necessary so they know the tyrant is really dead, and is not another trick.

I liked the episode. I don’t know or remember whats going on, but trough was getting more interesting and not less.

My nitpick here is that Loras is supposed to be one of the great warriors of the realm (and a savvy Heir to Highgarden in the shows) - Those are the dimensions of his character that need to be emphasized with limited screen time, IMO. Not his bedroom companion distracting him from a meeting with the King.

That’s what seemed off to me. The Tyrells are too wily and focused on growing strong to make those sort of mistakes. Even the Tyrell men, known for being the duller flowers in the bunch.

That episode was really dull. I think that for me, the spark is gone with this show. I really just want to read the next book, and I don’t want the show to spoil plot points for me. There are so many things weighing me down with this show right now. Missing certain characters (Team Strong Belwas) that I liked a lot, major story changes (Stoneheart). The show is moving away from what I liked about the books. Books are just better at telling stories than TV.

The show hasn’t been too bad with this, and some moments have been amazing to see live (Red Wedding), but part of me feels like the show is trying to shock us again to that level. More gore, more nudity, more shocking moments, but less substance?

Great instance of book vs. TV potrayals, is the depiction of the stench of Tywin’s corpse during his funeral in the books is incredible, and pretty hard to show on screen.

I have one arm left on the bandwagon, but my feet are dragging on the road.

I thought what we saw with Loras was how he thinks it’s game over, Tywin’s dead. Margaery is queen. The Tyrell plan has succeeded. From his point of view they can do whatever they like and not suffer any consequences. Imagine how he must feel, being able to be open in living his life now. It’s hard to keep your intensity up when you think you’ve won. Of course we in the audience know it’s not over till it’s over on this show, but he doesn’t know that.

It’s chaos now with Joffrey dead, and Tywin dead . . .

Essentially the Tyrells have no actual power now - except for the (victorious) armies they have fighting the wars and encamped all around King’s Landing.

They need to broker a new marriage contract with Margaery and Tommen so she can be Queen again.

There is a marriage contract between Cersei and Loras - with Tywin dead, that will never last.

Essentially, Cersei becomes Queen Regent again - making decisions for Tommen. Everyone in King’s landing will be jockeying for power - the Tyrells, Kevan Lannister, Cersei, Jaime, and the newly revived Church of the Seven.

They have lost Three members of the small council - Tyrion, Tywin and Varys. Only the Lannister lickspittle - Grand Maester Pycelle remains.

So, yeah, everyone will be jockeying for those roles - Hand of the King, members of the small council, future spouse of the king.

Which is, again, why Loras should be teaching Tommen how to fight. Margaery should be seducing him. Their father should be blustering about.

Actually - 4 members of the small council - Oberyn Martell was supposed to be seated on the small council - but he obviously has not taken that seat.

Essentially, the 8 member small council, as of the first episode of season 5, only has three actual small council members - Grand Maester Pycelle, and King Tommen - represented by his mother, the Queen Regent Cersei.

The show waffles as to whether or not Jaime Lannister is on the council as Lord Commander of the Kingsguard - he sure never attended council meetings under Tywin.

Tyrion’s trial by combat and subsequent escape and patricide has well and truly plunged the power structure into Chaos.

I’ll just keep replying to myself - Mace Tyrell is on the Small Council in Season 4 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q65s0h1rEds - so, 3 of 7 based on the last shown small council meeting.

Dany’s wig was more distracting to me than her covering herself up in a lovers’ context (and in fact, mock coyness in a lovers’ context can be fun :) ).

Second the googly eyes being disturbing, they always remind me of when things used to go horribly wrong modding Oblivion. You’d get everything set up seemingly just right, fire up the game and - googly eyes, and your heart would sink :) But the fact that they’re a bit disturbing I think makes them seem like an authentically weird religious rite, it’s a nice touch, and in fact one of the things that kind of caught my attention about the series in the very first episode (along with the silent sisters’ odd Asian-style wicker flag stand backpack thingies). Little touches and details like that (e.g. the design of clothes, armor, etc.) immediately felt like a lived-in world, but not our world, a dream-like world that’s both similar and different from our own.

I must admit, I found this first episode a bit dull, and things like the scene with Missandei talking to Grey Worm, seem like a complete waste of screen time.

Also there are weird things like, I bet you EVERYONE who saw the show wondered whether the bald Unsullied guy who gets killed was Grey Worm and they’d changed the actor. That’s far too distracting a thing to have right at the beginning of a season, especially coming on the heels of people having to wonder who the fuck the little girl is (although it’s pretty obvious pretty quickly). But still, shouldn’t have happened, there shouldn’t have been that opportunity for confusion, the guy should have looked very different from Grey Worm. Bad, silly slip up there, I think, not important, but perhaps indicative of how difficult juggling everything must be, and how hard to keep an overview or perspective on from the end-user’s point of view (but then again, that’s the while POINT of a producer/director role - to see a thing as the audience sees it, not as one of the makers sees it, i.e. to be able to hold both wood and trees in the mind at the same time).

But the show still has a lot of energy and goodwill it can coast on in the first few episodes while it sets things up, and it’s not a bad enough first episode to make me give up on the whole thing.

It is a bit scary being in a position of not knowing what’s going to happen - and that’s good. Although, the shoe being on the other foot, it’s like when I initially watched the first and second seasons again, before I’d caught up with all the books.

Haha, yup. That was exactly what I thought.

Same here - I’m glad they showed Grey Worm immediately in the next scene so all was well. But that was a bit ridiculous.

+1 for gurugeorge. I told my wife, “Welp, there goes Grey Worm,” and then they showed the next scene. Wonder… if that was deliberate.

Definitely a slow episode with some questionable choices. I care little for what’s er name and Grey Worm. I don’t want five minutes of Loras with a paid boy toy. That time is better spent with Arya learning that while all men must die, all little girls necessarily don’t have to be able to see ;)

One nice, if somewhat forced, touch: Sansa and Littlefinger cruising along right past the Beauty. 0/1 SANSAS, OH SO CLOSE PLAY AGAIN (Y/N)

I think it’s the fact that the show-runners have worked with the actor that plays Gray Worm (Jacob Anderson) so much that they just recognize him instantly and could never confuse him for… uh… (check IMDB) Marcos James… because they are radically different in height and body proportion and skin tone and jaw line and no one in their right mind would get them mixed up. But of course we the audience who haven’t seen Gray Worm/Anderson in the better part of a year just see a handsome, bald black dude in the “Unsullied” uniform and think “Oh hey, it’s Gray Worm! Wait, they just killed Gray Worm?!”

But maybe we’re underestimating the directors. Maybe that’s the reaction they wanted, and realized that the Unsullied were supposed to be more-or-less identical and decided to screw with us?