every action has a similar reaction in this world…
Frodo found the One Ring at the same time Sauron started to reanimate, he he …

I am not sure they would take that risk. I think people really like Jon and he has gotten a lot of screen time. I think the apparent outcome of unsaid event might be too much to risk a season-end on. I could see unsaid event occurring next episode, for the Internet wails, then Dany’s big seen in the final episode and just near the end a teaser about what the book readers are assuming will happen to Jon; Maybe a touch-of-Bran as well.

GRRM is too good with plotting to just let this be coincidence. Something happened to bring magic back, to awaken the Others. Book fans suspect Summerhall, but GRRM has yet to say.

I always thought it would make more sense to have the resurrection of the dragon eggs be the trigger that reawakened magic (and thus the walkers), but GRRM decided to have the magic-awakening happen first and make it possible for Dany to resurrect the eggs. Either way works.

It wasn’t too much of a risk for GRRM to end the latest book on. It seems to me that they would want the end of the 5th season to more-or-less end where the 5th book did.

Finally was able to sit down and watch this episode last night. Wow. In every previous season it has been Episode 9 that was the penultimate “holy shit” episode of the season, and with Hardhome being only Episode 8 it’s very difficult to see how they could pull off anything more impressive this coming weekend. I suspect the “holy shit” moment of this season will come not during an extended CGI sequence, but rather in a normal routine scene that ends in the shocking death of a main character akin to the Red Wedding or Ned’s execution.

There was much to like about this episode. Dany and Tyrion were so fun to watch together. Poor Jorah, spurned again. Some have asked why he would return to the fighting pits, and the answer is clear. The fight from the previous episode was in the lowest pit, a qualifier of sorts. The fight he and the slaver were discussing is in the main amphitheater in Meereen. The fighter who wins that fight wins the love of the people, glory and status. That is exactly the position Jorah wants to be in, as then Dany could not turn him away without angering the people. He could then make the argument that who better to be her protector than the knight who won the biggest “tournament” in all of the East? Jorah sees winning this contest as his only way back to Dany’s side.

The stuff in King’s Landing is following the books closely enough that it hasn’t been surprising at all, yet the writers and actors are doing it so well that I still find it fascinating to watch even though I know what is going to happen. Not so much the stories in Dorne and at Winterfell. While I enjoy the Jaime and Bronn show, and I am curious to see how Sansa copes with and grows given her current situation, both plotlines seem to be written by a second team of writers who are not as talented as those writing the main plotlines. I’m hopeful that this will change in the final two episodes, as both plotlines would seem to have things that need to be resolved prior to season’s end.

The Hardhome stuff was absolutely the highlight of the season thus far. It was easily the highlight of the Series thus far in terms of overall special effects, action and just pure excitement, though I think there have been other, less exciting scenes that have had a greater effect on viewers throughout the series (Ned’s execution, Red Wedding, etc.). Still, nothing can top that battle for pure awesome. Undead everywhere, creepy White Walkers watching form the cliffs, the rush to get on the boats and the giant covering Jon and company’s retreat while crushing undead in multiple creative ways. At the end I half-expected the giant to rise out of the water, recently expired from his wounds and answering the call of the White Walker. I’m surprised there weren’t any undead giants or mammoths in the White Walker army.

To those folks who wondered about the “zombies” and how/if they could be killed, I thought the show did a good job of showing us that in the battle scenes. It was really pretty much just a matter of common sense. We saw several undead go down for good when their heads were removed or skulls bashed in. Others were taken out by cutting them in half or otherwise damaging their bodies to the point where they were no longer mobile. Shooting/stabbing them in the chest, arms, legs and stomach were shown to be useless. Crushing them completely, as the giant was doing, was also an effective counter. The ones that dove off the cliff did so in such a way that the undead at the bottom of the pile were crushed, but those coming after were able to get up and keep fighting. The White Walkers knew they would lose some of their army that way, but what did they care when there were thousands more bodies waiting to be raised from the battlefield? I thought the entire sequence did a great job of conveying that, while it is possible to defeat the individual undead and even the White Walkers, they are coming on in such great numbers and with such ferocity that the struggle is hopeless, especially when at the end, the White Walkers will simply turn your fallen friends into more soldiers for their army.

Can’t wait to see what the final two episodes bring this season. I’m especially curious about Arya now that she’s reached pretty much the end of her book plotline. I think they’ve done a fine job of working her storyline so that it has remained interesting and exciting even when so is so far removed from everyone else and going through a training process that is fairly boring by comparison to all the other events taking place.

Is it possible to give a brief, non-spoilery recap of Summerhall? I haven’t immersed myself in the minutiae of the books, but it is sometimes interesting to hear the perspective of those who have.

I never understood the Summerhall theory - at least the connection between the Tragedy at Summerhall and magic coming back. Since the fire at Summerhall was 40 years before the books start, wouldn’t that be way before magic started to crop back up?

Jorah roasted or eaten by Drogon?

Okay, I read up a bit on The Tragedy at Summerhall and it seems to have more to do with the birth of Rhaegar than the resumption of magic in the world.

I would think that the birth of Jon, Dany or Bran would make a better catalyst.

Think someone more main charactery.

Unrelated: have we made “You know nothing Jon Rowe!” jokes in this thread? I wasn’t reading it at the start, and I’d hate to think it was overlooked.

It takes more than dragon fire though. The Targs had dragons for hundreds of years after Valyria blew, and they never forged any new blades. There’s a spell component that was lost.

Yeah, this is also true. But, I think that with the dragonglass being lava forged and the dragon fire used in valyrian steel, I think that dragon fire on it’s own is magical enough to do some damage itself. The problem isn’t even just the missing spells to create the steel, it is also probably the techniques and secrets that were lost when Valyria fell.

Unsurprisingly I have heard “You know nothing Jon Rowe” more than a few times from my girlfriend.

Aegon had gathered dragon eggs and the fire that consumed the summer palace was a result of an intentionally botched ritual to hatch those eggs. So there was at least some attempt at magic at Summerhall. There’s not much else to support the theory beyond that, but no other known event or act has more support either.

Perhaps in this universe people “soul” has magic power. Things like dragons are born only when a mayor blood sacrifice are made. The more powerful the person, the more power imbued. So sometimes killing a king is neccesary.

I know nothing of Summerhall, never heard of it before this weekend. Did king blood was sacrificed in that accident? If thats true, then maybe some eggs where kickstarted, that later hatched with Dany accident.

So with this idea, is blood sacrifices what fuel magic, big events caused by the spill of blood of kings. A lot of dead kings means a lot of magic around. So every one of the theories are somehow right: war cause the dead of kings in a violent way that cause magic, magic caused wars, blood sacrifices cause magic power, dragons are both the cause and the effect of magic.

anyway how magic works on GRRM universe is probably the less interesting thing.

My thought on her was that ultimately she’d see her remaining family again, but in her new faceless assassin form. That is, it won’t be a happy family reunion thing, more like “You’re alive” “Yep” “Later” “See ya”. She won’t have any interest in the goings on with who ever is left, it’s not like she’s ever going to live in Winterfell again. I can imagine her helping out by killing one last key opponent, then wandering off to her destiny whatever that is.

There have been a few conversations about this on various forums. The general idea seems to be that there are just many different kinds of magic. Blood magic is the one fuelled by souls or whatever, but the magic of the Children of the Forest is different from that, and from the magic of Rh’llor, which is different from dragon magic, which is different again from the magic of Asshai (Quaithe), which is different again from the magic of the vampires in Qarth, etc., etc. The world of ASoIaF has many varieties of magic, it’s just that it’s comparatively rare (compare and contrast with Middle Earth where there’s only one type of magic, also comparatively rare).

It’s obvious that GRRM likes to play around with and “ground” the post-Tolkein fantasy and fantasy gaming tropes (e.g. Targaryens = Elves, Tyrion = Dwarf), and I think in this instance he’s taken his cue from fantasy gaming, which has a multitude of many different magic types, but he’s imposing the same restriction of making it relatively rare (and therefore wondrous when it happens) that Tolkein did.

Then is more interesting, because it gives different motivations to different magic users. Magic could make people evil… or not. I like that.

I expect something like that as well. She’ll return to Westros, influence the resulting power struggle (not sure if for good, ill, or neither), and have a chance to rejoin the remnants of her family. But I think that she will find that she is no longer Arya Stark… she has become No One, and she’ll simply walk away.