He’s died six times and you don’t hear him bitching about it.
Even though this season is only seven episodes, I thought this one felt like a lot of filler. The dopey seven accomplished their goal, as we knew they would. Everyone who needed saving in the nick of time was saved in the nick of time. And we got an undead dragon. None of that was really much of a surprise.
I guess with the relatively slow pace at which the human war is progressing, it will not be wrapped up this season. I was kind of hoping they would take care of it in the season and focus next year on the undead horde but I guess things can’t be as clear-cut as all of that. Plus I suppose you can’t have one season of essentially nonstop battles, there has to be some intrigue to carry us over the finish line.
With Coldhand’s resolution this episode, and Gendry being found last episode, are there any loose strings from previous seasons left? The only thing I can think of is that Varys knows what happened in the Tower of Joy and knows the secret of Jon and don’t-call-me-Dany.
The dragons were really great this episode, and the reveal at the end was chilling. It reminded me much of the high fantasy ending to LOTR with the eagles, although this time the heroes had to pay a cost.
Still, though, there’s the exact same sloppy writing here that has plagued recent GoT TV. Some questions off the top of my head (that ignore the obvious points like the insanely slow travel speeds of the white walkers and the faster-than-light ravens):
- If the dragons are so easy to kill with those ice spears, why does the Night King take such a long time to get the second spear to throw at Drogon?
- Why does Jon keep running further away from Drogon when he could have just held his ground to fend off the zombies?
- Why does the entire white walker army walk away from Jon who fell in the water and barely notice his exit? It’s exactly like Jaime last week.
- Why didn’t zombies/skeletons crumble when Jon killed the white walker at hardhome? Why did only one zombie not explode when the white walker was killed this episode? It seems awfully convenient.
- Why wasn’t there time for Coldhands to jump on the horse when the stupid undead army were quite a distance away?
There are also some things that almost all other movies and TV shows are guilty of, but it still feels jarring here because the GRMM book universe is so tight. For instance, why do zombies take turns to run in and die instead of overwhelming the A-team, and why didn’t the A-team bring more than a few redshirts (mixing metaphors here I know) along to verse an entire army?
I know this one! It was because of the thin ice. They show the thrown stone skidding over without breaking it, and that giving them the idea that not going all at once will allow them to get across without crashing through.
At least, that’s what I got out of that bit.
That’s true, I forgot about that. It was strange to me that these zombies are too dumb to notice that the ice has frozen over again, but smart enough to coordinate a plan to stagger their entry.
Because… Oh, look! Dragons and zombies and stuff! Cool, right? What were we talking about again?
This was the episode where the travel speeds crossed the line for me. A lot of the earlier instances this season could be sort of vaguely hand-waved away by some wiggle room on what was simultaneous between different locations/plots, and the possibility of scenes that felt immediately sequential maybe having some time in between that they just didn’t show us. It always felt like lazy writing, and I wouldn’t blame someone if they;'d already decided the show had crossed the line on this.
But this was too far for me, this is where I just got angry at this dumb plan to capture a walker and the flagrant way all sense of place and time in Westeros is discarded.
There are plot holes in this episode, of course, but Benjen didn’t annoy me at all. (Ok, his arrival was too Hollywood-like, at the last moment, but…whatever.)
Putting aside the idea of the poor horse carrying two bodies instead of one, my interpretation is that Benjen wanted to bring his purpose to the conclusion.
I don’t buy the horse argument, they weren’t exactly traveling very far. Your interpretation of his death makes much more sense than if you take the dialogue at face value. I really doubt that the writers had what you said in mind when they wrote the scene, because if they did they would have Benjen say “it’s time” or “I can’t carry on” or even “I must buy you some time”… instead they have him say “there’s no time” and then crickets and tumbleweeds while he waits for the undead to catch up.
Luckily for me, I am not a fan of the authorial intent theory. Not at all :)
There is no time…
…to talk? To explain? That would make sense. That’s enough for me.
NO BOAT SEX???
My feeling exactly. I used to be a travel time apologist, but this was just too much. It ruined my enjoyment of what would otherwise have been an awesome scene.
Funny how no one thinks to wear a hood in horrible subfreezing cold. ;-)
OK I’ll admit I started rooting against Jon and his men because it was so fucking obvious that Gendry running all the way back to Eastwatch, recovering enough to tell them what’s going on, getting a message written out and onto a raven, the raven flying all the fucking way to Dragonstone, Dany flying all the fucking way to the North, and then Dany finding them in the middle of the fucking North would definitely all take like half a day max. Fuck you, GoT.
The dragon attack at the end was pretty awesome but the time bullshit is just ridiculous. I’ve been trying to just enjoy this season and not get annoyed by crap like this but tonight’s episode was just too much.
As long as I’m at it, what’s with the bear attack? Where did the entire group disappear to while Thoros was getting mauled? It seemed everyone was just kind of “around” but no one bothered to attack until Beric comes and stabs the bear in the back and it magically just dies. Was that supposed to be an obsidian dagger? Don’t those only kill White Walkers? Why did one little stab suddenly bring it down when being on fire just seemed to piss it off? Seemed like a lot of stupid crap this episode but the time travel takes the cake.
The dialogue between the characters on the march was great though. Complete filler, but really good filler.
Seemed like they should have, you know, torched the night king?
Especially when he was getting his second javelin? Like, uh, just torch him? He’s not that far away.
Bah, I liked the episode. I loved the commentary between Tormund and the Hound especially. I’m still overlooking all this time-travel bullshit because for fucks sake, I need this show to end at some point. We have, what, eight episodes counting next season? A lot needs to happen. I’m all for ditching the season 3-4 craptastic, nothing ever happens, timelines.
There was a fantastical fight with an out-of-nowhere zombie bear, PUG party battles extraordinaire, awesome dragon battle scenes, sad-face dragon death and subsequent zombie dragon reveal, Don’t-call-me-Dany and Jon’s hand holding intensifies, and Arya going all “girl I will MESS YOU UP,” on Sansa. I enjoyed the shit out of all of it.
We’re all lined up for the previous spoilery reveal of next episode being in or near King’s Landing with power pixie cut Cersei, and a possible Clegan-bowl brother brawl.
This is where I am. Tell me how the story ends. I get it is impossible for a guy to run, and a raven to act as a sort of email. The alternative is that the stand off stays stood off for 3 episodes while we have Gendry show up next episode, and the dragons show up the 3rd.
It doesn’t really bother me. I guess they also could have just had something where they brought a raven with them in a cage to send updates, but meh.
Well, the action stuff was kind of predicable, but the fight scenes and especially the dragon stuff was really well done (no pun intended).
The theme of (most of) the episode was succeeding or failing in letting go of the past.
The entire trekking scene across the glacier was a bunch of men telling each other that all the crap they thought was important in previous episodes is pretty much moot now, and they ought to get over it and move on. Tormund lets the Hound know that his scars are no big deal; Berrik sort of shrugs off the resurrection-angst that Jon Snow’s been brooding on for a season or so; Gendry gets slapped down and ribbed for the whole “selling him off to a witch” thing. And Captain Friendzone sheds yet another part of his past by officially giving his family’s priceless super-weapon away.
Meanwhile, Arya and Sansa are utterly failing to let go of their previous rivalries and jealousies, and are mired knee-deep in something traumatic that they should be bonding over rather than squabbling about. And Littlefinger got to twirl his mustache yet again.
The rest of the episode was just waiting to see which one of the Scruffy Seven was going to die, because someone had to. Everyone knew that a dragon was going to bite it, so Mormont couldn’t go. Snow’s got too much plot-armor to die. Likewise, Clegane-bowl has to happen, thus the Hound was safe. Gendry dying one episode after being reintroduced seemed unlikely.
I was certain that it was going to be Tormund… even after Thoros actually died. Him getting saved by the Hound before being pulled under was one of the few surprising things about the episode.
Sucks to be a random Wildling in the employ of Jon Snow. They didn’t wear red, but they should have. Someone upthread asked why the main character didn’t wear hoods in the driving blizzard conditions, and the answer is that if you wear a hood you’re marked for death-by-zombie. You get carried off by a zombie-bear or you get ripped apart by zombie-humans. Wearing a hood beyond the wall is an instant death sentence. It is known.
The Night King (like slow zombies everywhere) represents the slow and inevitable march of death. No need for him to hurry; he’ll get you eventually. Here now, or there later. It’s no biggie for him.
I’m serious.
I got nothing for this one.
The currents in the lakes and rivers of Westros are stunningly strong. Ravens fly across the continent at lightning speeds, but they have nothing on the trout.
Seriously, why would they have assumed he was still alive? As we learned this week the wights don’t seem to have shared vision: the trussed-up one had to verbally scream for help. So the wights above the ice wouldn’t have known that Jon (apparently) killed the ones that dragged him under, and they were mostly facing the other way marching off when he pulled himself out of hypothermia-land.
They touched on that, didn’t they? The ones that crumble are the ones that were “raised” by that particular guy. So one of his crew was raised by one of his buddies. Presumably when the unlucky walker died, a couple lone wights collapsed some three hundred miles away, pissing off one of his pals.
Likewise, maybe the walker at hardhome didn’t raise any of the army there… or maybe he did and they DID collapse, but off-camera. Jon killed him inside the building, right?
Listen, saving people at the last minute is tiring, tedious work. No one ever appreciates how much planning and unglamourous drudge-work is involved. You have to get the set-up and the timing JUST right or the entire effect is wasted. If I were Benjen, I’d want out too.