Casualty evacuation.
I think Tom’s comment points out my main problem with the series (which is still great by the way). The way company grade and higher officers are portrayed is a bit off. I know I am biased, but in order to become a recon company commander, you just aren’t your run of the mill USMC infantry officer. These guys are selected through some pretty rigorous screening. I hate swimming so I never even thought about applying (and I don’t know why people want to jump out of perfectly good aircraft), but the people that I know who are or were recon officers (including my brother-in-law) were pretty sharp individuals.
So I agree, that scene looked pretty staged.
Otherwise (and I know I am repeating myself), this is the best video about modern day combat I’ve ever seen. It gets so many of the not so comfortable details correctly - I laughed my ass off when they talked about the “shitters” and were using ammo crates. I don’t know any show/movie that has gotten so many of these little details correctly.
I also think that while the series makes judgements about the wisdom of the swiftness of recon’s advance, that is the type of thing that the USMC does and yes, it is valued during war time. A regimental commander was relieved of duty (by Gen Mattis) because his unit could not execute in that way and although the recon battalion commander is being shown in an unfavorable light, I do understand why he is behaving the way he is. He understands what Mattis’ intent is and he is executing it. The scene where he is pissed off about Alpha’s inability to do the recon in time was pitch perfect.
Lacking HBO, I haven’t seen the episode, but I’ve read the book and Fick’s One Bullet Away. The way those books describe the incident, it really sounds like Fick pushed the limits of what a junior officer can get away with. I’m surprised he didn’t get dressed down for it later.
Fick’s version of the event is different. It has Major Benelli as the main obstacle between them and the colonel, and a much more straightforward delivery of the children to the battalion HQ after the initial request for casevac is declined. The doctor puts them down with a “you want to let them die, they can die in front of your tent”, and the colonel’s awakened and simply decides to send the children with the detached platoon. FWIW.
Some interesting things I came across while looking for responses to the show.
quick David Simon/Evan Wright interview
Article about prescreening at Camp Pendleton
“We screened this at Camp Pendleton,” said Eric Kocher, a former Marine and military advisor for Generation Kill. “We screened it to the real Bravo 2 Marines and the biggest comments they say are, you know, the dialog is excellent,” Kocher added. “It hits exactly the way Marines talk, and the atmosphere is visually what you see, what you hear in the background. Everything is it. It hits Iraq…That’s the biggest comments that everyone tells me, especially in the Marine community.”
Apparently there were real consequences for the enlisted Marines quoted in that book.
As far as accuracy
Lately, the Marine command has revised its view of Mr. Wright’s account, Sergeants Kocher and Espera said. They said the commander at First Reconnaissance had ordered his officers to read the book and the articles to get a clear idea of what war is like for enlisted men.
Major Douglas Powell, a Marine spokesman, said the members of the Marine Corps had not yet read the book, but added, ‘‘I’m not aware of anyone raising a stink over anything in the articles in terms of accuracy.’’
And then there’s at least one rebuttal link at the bottom of the wiki allegedly from the “night vision guy” company gunny or possibly his brother, who knows.
So, I don’t know what to say. I guess I’ll just relate it to my reaction back in the day to Jarhead: I like it because it feels like the truth, even if contains a lot of synthesizing and personal bias and possibly even outright fabrications. Combat memories are difficult to get straight. I’m sure even at my level if you spoke to the Marines in my squad they would have significantly different recollections of who fucked up where, and obviously the choices of those in charge are magnified even down to the team leader level.
Whatever crisis occurred over those wounded children, I bet it felt like the end of the world at every stage to the Marines involved. I’m not surprised the confrontation or whatever led to their evac becomes mythologized a bit.
Good episode, though. I’ve never been quite in Colbert’s position, but they did a good job of bringing it to life from what I can see.
Also, another counterpoint from a major working with the battalion as a forward air controller. Very interesting, but ultimately nothing is really going to settle these things. I keep noticing the things nobody seems to rebut most of all.
This event as described in Wright’s book jives with Fick’s account (which I haven’t read yet). He states that it takes 5 minutes before Ferrando changes his mind and sends the kid to the shock trauma unit. The “tough choices” speech from Ferrando occurs after the kid has left and the speech is really a conversation between Ferrando and the reporter.
So what the fuck? That’s messed up…makes Ferrando look like a clown. We’ll just have to keep triangulating from the sources, I guess.
Captain America, are they embellishing a bit the histrionics here? Also, do M16s really have attachments for bayonets?
Well, probably. He seemed more like a straightforward jerkoff from what I recall of the book, but it is telling that Fick does not mention him at all. In a way.
And yes, they do. It’s a little nub underneath and in front of the front sight post. But I’ve never seen it in use outside of boot camp bayonet “training”.
That sounds like the Desert Storm marines I’ve known personally. They never agree on the details of what the other is saying.
This thing is so hard to watch. Really a bad idea at night.
Oh wow, rudy is the actual guy? And here I was thinking he was too much of a caricature to be real…
edit: Christ. After reading that, it’s going to be even harder to watch the show.
I think the series is taking it a bit easier on Captain America (in terms of portraying him as a complete dufus) than the book does.
SPOILER:
There is another, even more outrageous event involving Captain America and a bayonet coming up - we’ll see if or how HBO does it.
I finally got to see the episode last night, it was really, really good.
Once scene in particular that stood out to me is the scene where the marines are assaulting the airfield. The way they shot that scene, with the Humvees speeding through the desert, it was genuinely scary, especially when they all opened fire on the airfield. I imagined what it would be like to be an Iraqi sitting there and watching that coming, and how the hell I’d survive it. Don’t those mounted guns fire depleted uranium rounds? You can’t even be safe behind solid cover with those flying at you. It’s no wonder they all fled.
.50 cal, not DU rounds. DU rounds are for tanks and for A-10’s
Still, scary stuff. That scene really drew me in, it gave me a taste of what it must feel like to go into battle.
Man, way to make the “screwbie” go from sympathetic to reviled in the span of a few sentences at the end, there.
“No, I mean you, sir. I mean you gave the orders.”
“HEY ABOUT FUCK YOU TROMBLY I THINK MAYBE YOU’LL WALK 100 YARDS IN FRONT OF THE HUMVEE FROM NOW ON.”
Jagoff. I appreciated the implications with that whole affair, however: they did order that everyone in that AO (did I do that right?") be treated as hostiles, which sounded all cool and shit at first but there’s the potential fallout of giving such an order right there.
“They shot our water!”
I love this show but I love this thread more.
As they mentioned in the episode, the Iraqis had tanks. T-72’s. Had those been manned all the scary would have been on the US side. For a couple hours anyway, until air support could be detached and take them out.