I can’t decide :(
Is the Radeon 9800 Pro worth $180 more than the 9800?
You must be buying a Dell as I’ve seen that price difference in their ads. I would go with the Pro version though you are probably safe with either. Is it one of the new XPS models?
-DavidCPA
Yes, getting an XPS. I have a $100 off coupon that expires 6/27. I may wait until next Thursday cause their current deals aren’t that attractive (free 2nd drive CD burner, free extra warranty, mail-in rebate). Taking the gamble that next week is better ;)
I’ve configured a system:
p4 2.8
1 gig ram
Radeon 9800 PRo
120 GIG HD
no monitor
rest standard stuff
This is about $2100 shipped with the current deal and not including the mail-in rebate of $100 but does include the coupon.
If you are talking about the 256mb one vs. the 128mb one then no unless you plan on keeping it for 5 years and probably not even then.
We are discussing a similar topic here: http://www.quartertothree.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4201 .
At this point 256mb cards are not terribly worthwhile as can be seen here: http://www6.tomshardware.com/graphic/20030604/radeon_9800-04.html#unreal_tournament_2003
My suggestion is the 9700 Pro if you want a top end card without the top end price. It is about 10% slower than the 9800 Pro and around $80 cheaper. The 9500 Pro as was mentioned in that other thread is a good budget choice since it is 25% slower than the 9700 Pro and about $80 cheaper if you discount refurbs.
– Xaroc
Edit: didn’t see you were buying a Dell until after I put this together. I would go with the one that was $180 cheaper because the performance difference won’t be $180 worth.
Nice little setup. The 1 GB of RAM is a very good idea these days. Many games seem to be hogging RAM and not just from memory leaks - Planetside anyone?
-DavidCPA
Geesh, $2100 for that limited list of stuff with no monitor? Seems way steep.
Must be a DVD-R burner in there or some other hidden item you didn’t mention. Dell prices are typically slightly better than building it all yourself from http://www.newegg.com
Hold off for a few hours. We’ll have a detailed review up on Extremetech late this afternoon.
There’s a man who knows how to put the “tease” in teaser!
Yeah that seems very steep. I got my wife a Dell for 429 after rebates and instant savings it had:
P4 2.53
60 GB hard drive
CD-R/RW
Crap video card
onboard network, sound
and 128mb of memory
I grabbed a 512mb stick of pc2700 ram from newegg for 60 bucks shipped and threw in a gf4 4200 we got for 130 and bingo a $720 system that handles pretty much anything my wife would ever want to play for the next 3+ years. It also stands up pretty well with that $2100 monstrosity for a 3rd of the price.
Make sure to check http://www.gotapex.com/ they have Dell deals and coupons almost daily.
– Xaroc
I forgot to add that the review is embedded in a mini-roundup, which will be called something like “ExtremeTech’s High End System”. I built a system, and compared it to a Dell XPS and Gateway 700XL.
Be sure to point out how noisy the various systems are.
I do discuss it in the review. The Dell, is by far, the quietest. But there are other… issues.
I believe the reviews are supposed to go up at 4PM PDT>
An XPS is also reviewed in this month’s CGW and Maximum PC so you can check those out for their comments as well.
-DavidCPA
Hey Case, I read the review. Good article.
The Dell seemed to perform fine in games compared to the other two systems. It was only the one test, it appeared, where the Dell just shit a brick. Do you think game performance should be identical for the systems as shown through your numerous game tests or is that one test where Dell choked on itself something to worry about in gaming?
thanks :)
Dell set out to build a good gaming box, and it does run games well. I think it’s a tad overpriced, though, for what you get. The Gateway really hung in there, and it’s $500 less (though that 700XL case is a clunker).
However, the Dell is very quiet, and has good internal expansion. If you get a beefy enough processor that will last for a few years, then it’s fine. I just can’t figure out why it either can’t complete on of our tests, or runs another one ludicrously slowly. Any time I run into potential compatibility issues, I start to get a little worried.
Are the test performance problems a heat issue? In Maximum PC, a couple of their tests on the Dell ran unusually slow. After they let it cool down, the tests ran much faster. Dell said the CPU fan speed would be increased to help lower the temp (MPC was testing a early production model). The Dell is setup to run very quietly (big heatsink, air tunnel cover, etc), but they may not have the temp/performance mix down pat yet.
Loyd…I have to ask, do you hareware review guys ever shed a tear when you return the review models? I guess it isn’t such a big deal anymore since you can purchase and build you own cutting edge machine much cheaper than in previous years, but it still must be a little difficult.
-DavidCPA
I had a preproduction unit that had some pretty bad overheating issues (Jason Cross ran into this as well). Dell shipped my a production unit, and it’s the one I reviewed.
I suppose it could be thermal throttling, but other very CPU intensive tests didn’t slow down the way 3D Studio did. The After Effects test is something else.
However, it ran every game test without any burps or hiccups. We’ve been using it for LAN gaming, and it’s done great there, too. So for that purpose, it should be great.
Yeah, sending back hardware – particularly good hardare – is difficult at times. But there’s always something else coming down the pipe.
As far as pricing goes, I just priced out two nearly identical Dell and Gateway systems and it seemed nearly identical unless you go ultra high-end (like those in your tests). Pricing out more “realistic” 1700-2000$ systems seemed pretty much in line.
Thanks for your input!
I had a preproduction [DELL] unit that had some pretty bad overheating issues (Jason Cross ran into this as well). Dell shipped my a production unit, and it’s the one I reviewed.
Let’s see. What Q23 user already brought this exact issue up in another thread two months ago? Oh yeah, that’s right, it was me.
Not entirely fair, since Dell uses P4 chips exclusively. In overheat conditions, these chips throttle themselves down-- way down. Which is preferable to the Athlon XP “china syndrome” approach, to be sure, but this also gives OEMs like Dell the ability to use sub-standard cooling and effectively get away with it. Business users would never notice the difference anyway.
I can’t remember what forum I read this on, but one tech support guy said the first thing they did when they got P4 boxes shipped back was run 3DMark on them. If the scores were abnormally low (like 1/4 what they should be), they knew that the fan wasn’t functioning on the heatsink.
To which Case replied:
I’ve never had a Dell throttle down on me, even in heavy gaming sessions. The ducted fan works quite well.
Oh, SNAP! I’m declaring myself a future predictin’ genius in the Dave Long style. Added bonus: I actually out-hardwared the hardware guru.
To which I respond, I still haven’t had a Dell throttle down on me.
Beta units don’t count; people don’t buy beta units. The XPS production unit has had issues, but thermal throttling hasn’t been one of them.