Well, Rogue had a similar lack of documentation when it was released, no? Half the fun (and frustration) was trying to figure out what did what! Perhaps that was TM’s intention with Hinterlands, as well.
That has been my thought regarding TM’s intentions, but in the day of GameFAQs and $20 strategy guides and game Atlases, gamers may no longer want to figure things out. Still, not knowing how much the fertilizer bag helps as opposed to the hoe is irritating.
Hey, can we go one damn page without Tyjenks throwing in his 2 cents?!?! That bastard is wearing me out.
I played Hinterland 3 times and I find that my interest has waned somewhat. There’s really not much replayability, or rather, challenge.
I have 2 suggestions that I think will greatly increase the challenge:
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ability to select the size of my town. I’d imagine if I can only have 6 buildings and have to demolish the farm to make way for a wizard tower, near end game, when I have lots of food to sustain the town, would create more depth and challenge.
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The enemy could reclaim back areas which I won… eg they could take back the quarry to prevent me from upgrading my town… and I’d have to fight back… kinda basic capture the flag or other skirmish scenarios in RTS - I’m sure the dev have thought about it but I wonder the reasons for not implementing it…
Finally, for the love of all that is holy, someone please put in an option for V-sync. I haven’t seen this much screen tearing since the last time I played an Xbox 360 game.
LOL, looks like I am not the only one complaining about V-Sync…
Further proof that Tom hates games that are fun.
Just finished a game with an architect on Medium, and I still think Hinterland is awesome. I do think it’s intended to be played on punishing difficulty levels like a Roguelike where actually winning a game is a big deal – playing on a level where you can win every time would certainly get boring.
More thoughts on the interface and gameplay stuff:
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For the love of the God of Assassins, increase the target radius! I misclick attacks half the time. :(
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What’s the point of a necromancer’s undead followers? I invited him into my party after he had raised a few corpses but they stayed behind. Are they just for town defense?
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Are there any upgraded guard visitors? I had a vacated archer tower after a rather unfortunate excursion, and a regular guard visitor wouldn’t move in there. He wouldn’t move from his new guard house into the archer tower, either. I did get a dark priest for my recently vacated dark temple but I never saw upgraded guards.
They joined my necromancer in the field.
- Are there any upgraded guard visitors? I had a vacated archer tower after a rather unfortunate excursion, and a regular guard visitor wouldn’t move in there. He wouldn’t move from his new guard house into the archer tower, either. I did get a dark priest for my recently vacated dark temple but I never saw upgraded guards.
I’ve seen them but I had to hit advertise a few times.
My 2 cents on gameplay:
Acolytes, herbalists (healing potions), and loot drops trivialize everything else that I can do. I hate the fact that when I upgraded an acolyte to an evil priest, he became “weaker” because he stopped healing me. So I booted him from the town and got myself another acolyte because they’re more useful. :(
It was definitely a great $20 purchase, but the replayability factor isn’t there for me because of balance issues.
Strange, I don’t recall seeing them. Maybe they are really slow?
Acolytes, herbalists (healing potions), and loot drops trivialize everything else that I can do. I hate the fact that when I upgraded an acolyte to an evil priest, he became “weaker” because he stopped healing me. So I booted him from the town and got myself another acolyte because they’re more useful. :(
“Trivialize?” That’s an intentional gameplay mechanic. You’re not supposed to blindly upgrade everything; new isn’t better for some building types, just different. Why do you think there are so many building plots in the town? Don’t boot the evil priest, just get another healer. I think Majesty was similar in this regard. I like this feature a lot since it gets rid of the stupid “upgrade everything ASAP” busywork of typical RTS games.
Also, one guy who makes healing potions doesn’t actually make the game that much easier if you’re playing on harder levels and encounter monsters that are 4-5 levels higher than you…
The healer acolyte is definitely handy when adventuring but he’s also extremely fragile (as you would expect), he can’t attack monsters, and he can’t even heal himself. In a party of four he takes up one slot that could be filled with a guy who can actually fight.
It was definitely a great $20 purchase, but the replayability factor isn’t there for me because of balance issues.
My understanding is that the game is not even supposed to be balanced. Just like roguelikes, you get thrown into some arbitrarly shitty situation and try to survive!
Or bring a doctor. I’m not sure if an acolyte has items which can speed healing, but a doctor does (e.g. bandages), so he may actually heal better.
Another thing, if cash isn’t a big problem (and it usually isn’t in the end game), then boot your existing guys for new guys. Your upgraded Level 1 Doctor (or whatever other profession) is totally suck-ass if you intend to take him into the battlefield. Keep advertising until you get a high-level herbalist whom you can convert into a replacement doctor. The same goes for guards etc. I find that buying a replacement (as an opportunity presents itself) tends to be a better solution than trying to level up guys.
Dunno. Maybe they can get stuck in terrain, unlike followers who seem to teleport out of stuck situations to catch up with you?
“Trivialize?” That’s an intentional gameplay mechanic. You’re not supposed to blindly upgrade everything; new isn’t better for some building types, just different. Why do you think there are so many building plots in the town? Don’t boot the evil priest, just get another healer. I think Majesty was similar in this regard. I like this feature a lot since it gets rid of the stupid “upgrade everything ASAP” busywork of typical RTS games.
We may have to agree to disagree here. I just don’t think the most useful (healing) game mechanic should be available at the level one building stages. Another case in point: turning an herbalist into an alchemist so he can make random potions that aren’t as good as healing potions.
Also, one guy who makes healing potions doesn’t actually make the game that much easier if you’re playing on harder levels and encounter monsters that are 4-5 levels higher than you…
I’ve been playing on hardcore and there’s never a need to go against such creatures. But if you get into a bad situation by accident, having a ton of healing potions on hand is the best solution.
The healer acolyte is definitely handy when adventuring but he’s also extremely fragile (as you would expect), he can’t attack monsters, and he can’t even heal himself. In a party of four he takes up one slot that could be filled with a guy who can actually fight.
I haven’t found healers to be fragile at all, because they never get attacked.
My understanding is that the game is not even supposed to be balanced. Just like roguelikes, you get thrown into some arbitrarly shitty situation and try to survive!
There’s a difference between random setups and the balance of various game mechanics. I’m pretty sure toning down healing could make the game more interesting. Perhaps cap the speed of healing potion creation regardless of how many herbalists you have. Perhaps boss monsters that can poison you so that standard healing potions won’t work.
I’m not sure what could be done to fix the fact that craftsmen are useless because loot drops are better than anything they can make, other than making the game more mundane with less magic items to find. People probably wouldn’t like that, though.
Sure, but as I said before – just get a new herbalist. I like it that way. Shrug.
I’ve been playing on hardcore and there’s never a need to go against such creatures. But if you get into a bad situation by accident, having a ton of healing potions on hand is the best solution.
Don’t you ever want to unlock some resource that’s guarded by high-level creatures?
I haven’t found healers to be fragile at all, because they never get attacked.
Then you got lucky because mine certainly did get attacked, and barely got out alive!
I’m not sure what could be done to fix the fact that craftsmen are useless because loot drops are better than anything they can make, other than making the game more mundane with less magic items to find. People probably wouldn’t like that, though.
I agree that smith items tend to be somewhat useless by the time you’ve got their shops all upgraded. The fletcher is useful if you don’t happen to come across bows and want better hunters or ranged attackers, though, and you can always have craftsmen sell their items for daily gold if you have a merchant.
But the point is that I’m just going to have them all be herbalists (and/or doctors since they make healing potions too). I wish that there could be a circumstance that would make me want to have an alchemist, but there isn’t from what I can tell.
Don’t you ever want to unlock some resource that’s guarded by high-level creatures?
I suppose if herbs are out there, that would be the one resource that I might try to rush in for “early” to nab. Other than that, it always seems wiser to tackle the areas that match your level to build up your resources.
Well, as you point out, herbalists upgrade to doctors who can make better health potions. Alchemists can make decent other potions, but can also research even better versions and then make them. Plus, alchemists upgrade to wizards if you can find a tome.
Last game I ended up with an alchemist, a herbalist, and an doctor. Potion production seemed about perfect for that game.
I’m liking it so far. I go with hardcore/small games mostly, with the occasional medium or large.
The town does have too much space for my tastes. Hopefully TM will add a town size setting, with corresponding increases in the score multiplier for small plots.
Like some of the others, I don’t even bother with any of the crafters except as a source of gold and health potions. A difficulty setting for loot quality would help. If weapon and armor drops were rare, I’d pay more attention to smithing and prayer bonuses.
A lot of balance gripes could be fixed by working them into the difficulty system, I imagine.
One suggestion about making crafters better, would be to have misc items that will make them create higher level items. Perhaps finding magic metal for crafters, or enchanted lumber for flechers. So does the doctor heal better then the acolyte?
It seems like he does, when equipped with bandages.
Watchmen should come into your town in you have a watchtower vacant.
Necro not bringing skeletons would be a bug and one we never saw, so if you do see it again, please PM me and we can troubleshoot / get a save.
Alchemist makes some extremely potent potions. Some of the Witch trinkets and Alchemist potions are designed to help you overcome those ‘unfair encounters’. Stoneskin, Harden, Heavy hands- are all more valuable than a healing potion. (Heavy hands with a ‘brutal’ dagger is a nasty combination- anything marked brutal has a 5% chance to stun.)
The poison the Alchemist casts probably needs a rebalance to make him more powerful, but really he is intended to stay home and crank out the potions.
The bandages help the healing rate IN TOWN. They do not increase the effectiveness of his ability to heal in combat.
The ‘ideal’ or typical layout might be in town: One doctor, one alchemist. In party an acolyte, light priest, or herbalist.
The value of the craftsman changes 500% depending on the class you take. I had forgotten this and the last time I played a Knight I realized I did not need him really much at all. As an outlaw, I usually hire him as the third person in town. The thing is, you can always convert him to making money for you- so he never goes out of style! You may also notice that the best way to get helms, and shields is to make them yourself in town.
Just thought I’d share something that happened to me during my game last night, because I was shocked and thrilled to see it.
I’ve been getting my self accustomed to the game by playing on lower difficulty levels, and hadn’tyet played any with random resources, so I started a large game with random resources on.
As my gameplay continued and I explored the area, I realized that there was no water on the map anywhere, which meant loss of many upgrades. No big deal though, I’ll adjust. I did manage to find a dragon egg in a chest, so I happily upgraded a herder and went back out exploring. I usually leave the dragoneer in town for a while after getting the egg, to let the dragon level up.
Anyway, I got a message that a raiding party was headed to my town, and I checked the region map, and saw it would be easier for me to cut them off instead of run back to town. I did intercept them, four ogres, and dispatched them easily.
However, this is the exciting part - when looting the ogres, I found that one of them had TWO MORE DRAGON EGGS on him.
For some reason I had just assumed that “Dragoneer” was one of those classes that was unique, but apparently not.
I haven’t finished playing this particular game yet, but I did get two more dragoneers going before heading to bed. However, I’m thinking that going out and finishing up with three dragons is going to more than make up for my lack of a water source. :D
I was thinking Watchmen, which as Jeff pointed out do appear. Archers don’t appear I guess; I just played a game and hit advertise about 30 times in a row and never saw an archer, so I had to demolish the archery range.
So, the game I just played (journeyman/hardcore/long) didn’t have herbs so I couldn’t abuse healing potions. I tried to take out a party without the healer/light priest occasionally, but it’s just too tedious to have to return to town to heal after taking some damage, especially on an herb-free map.
I don’t think you can. I think if you have a [living] acolyte or upgraded acolyte, another acolyte won’t ever visit your town. I could be wrong; it’s hard to know anything for sure in this game because of the minimal documentation.
I just have one question so far: Does anyone know what the curse some magic users cast does?
I’ve had dark priests or witches in my party and run into orc shamans out in the wild, at which point the shaman cast curse on me and my magic user cast curse on him… and nothing visible happened to our stats or anything. I’ve waded into combat cursed but don’t seem to do or take any less or more damage. (Incidentally, I thought the Alchemist cast curse too until I just read Jeff’s post saying he cast poison, so I’m obviously not looking closely enough.)
I have, however, discovered that if you take their staff away for a second so they go into attack mode and give it back, they will sit there and shoot fireballs at their target until it dies before going back to cursing.
Hardcore stresses me too much, but I just had my bestest score on Difficult. Medium Map with a Brawler and had 24,000 points. Wheee. Damn, can’t get my Flickr image to show.