2971

Unclear whether they jumped or were pushed, but yeah, whoever is gonna make this case is gonna have to lie to the court.

Though I guess they could also play really, really dumb, which should come naturally to Trump appointees.

2972
2973

Lovely…

Since 1980, the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development has allowed households that include noncitizens to receive benefits for public or subsidized housing, but the proposed rule would rescind that coverage for current recipients and any going forward. Those under 62 who are living in mixed-status homes who don’t have a citizen as the head of household could be evicted or their benefits dropped if the rule takes effect.

The department estimates the financial impact to be anywhere from $179 million to $210 million.

Nationally, the rule-change would affect 25,000 families, or roughly 100,000 people, according to HUD. As many as 6,000 households in Texas could be affected.

2974

WTF? ‘Non-citizen’ isn’t a synonym for ‘illegal immigrant’. There are millions of legal immigrants who are not citizens.

2975

Put that on a quiz or poll, and I am guessing a good chunk of fellow Americans would not pass it.

2976

Neither is “undocumented” but that appears to be the term of choice on this forum.

2977

It is technically correct to describe the group of people living in the US without valid legal status as “undocumented” and it is also technically correct to describe that group as “illegal”, and it is also technically correct to describe that group as “unauthorized”. Members of the group are undocumented immigrants in that they do not in fact have valid documentation of legal status in the US. They are also illegal immigrants in that they do not in fact have the actual valid legal status itself, regardless of documentation (in most cases, that is why they don’t have documentation: they are not legally eligible to obtain that documentation).

The term you use is really a choice of connotation. The GOP uses “illegal” b/c they are trying to connote that this group of immigrants are bad, while liberals use “undocumented” to try to connote a less negative meaning.

Personally, I think "unauthorized’ is the best term b/c I feel that “illegal” is prejudicial and “undocumented” is disingenuous. But, technically speaking, all 3 descriptors are accurate.

2978

I don’t even know what that comment means. Choosing particular, accurate language to describe something is very different than pretending that two things are opposites.

2979

I don’t think I have seen anyone use “unauthorized” before, but based on your definitions it does make sense. I find using “undocumented” and avoiding their illegal status to be disingenuous. Factually describing them doesn’t have to indicate a hatred or fear of them.

2980

Technically true but in the context of conservative animus to this group of immigrants and comments like “they are not sending their best”, I find the constant use of “illegal immigrant” to be prejudicial and galling (even though I slip and use it myself too often). It doesn’t have to indicate hatred or fear, but in our discourse it often does.

2981

The reason why undocumented has a special meaning is that it allows a hard distinction to be made between ‘illegal immigrants’ who came originally came by plane (i.e. Europe/Africa/Asia) vs land and sea(Central / South America).

The simple fact that the original point of entry was an airport for “documented illegal immigrants” (i.e. overstaying a visa) means that a certain level of vetting had to had been done by the govt on both sides to allow for entry into the US while this doesn’t exist for undocumented immigrants, so it allows for public safety to be brought into question for this group…

2982

While this discussion is certainly important, this article just says households who don’t have citizens as a head household, and you can be legally here, paperwork and everything is in order, and still not be a citizen. So this will include a group of legal and documented and authorized people that aren’t usually targeted by either group like this.

2983

“The Illegals” term also implies brown/black/coloured peoples (ie. “the blacks”) whereas I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone refer to “the undocumented” as a throng of ethnic people.

2984

The phrase “Illegal immigrants” has always been a dog whistle, whose subtly is exposed these days by the shortened version, “illegals.” People can commit illegal acts but people cannot be illegal in and of themselves. Saying that the immigrants are “illegal” is a way of dehumanizing them — They are not people who have committed crimes, they themselves are crimes.

Undocumented migrants is an acurate description which does not dehumanize and it is the preferable term for anyone who understands the danger inherent in dehumanizing large groups of people.

2985

How about migrants who have committed the crime of illegally entering the country? For what ever reason.

Wiping away the illegal entry does nothing to legitimize them.

And don’t get me wrong. I don’t blame them one bit for wanting to improve their lives.

2986

I mean, if breaking a law is grounds for deserving the appellation “illegal,” then I may need to begin to refer to everyone who shared the left lane of the highway with me on the way home last month illegals, as well.

2987

I bet you have road rage problems. I can just imagine you yelling “I am going to shit on your grave!” to anyone who cuts you ff.

2988

Although I agree that “illegal immigrant” is a pejorative and dehumanizing term, I also feel like “undocumented immigrant” is disingenuous: it makes it sound like the issue is a mere paperwork problem, if only those pesky documents hadn’t gotten lost or if only those lazy bureaucrats would just hurry up and process the paper, but that’s not accurate, in either case. The real issue for most folks in this category is lack of valid legal status, lack of valid legal authorization, to be in the US or to work in the US.

So, when I remember, I try to use “unauthorized immigrant”.

In the big picture, this entire issue keeps coming back to the need for comprehensive reform, to address the status of people who are already here, and to deal with the reality of people continuing to attempt to come here outside the legally authorized process, and the reality of the many employers who continue to hire and employ people illegally. In the big picture, lack of valid legal status, and the related issue of illegal employment, is the underlying issue.

2989

I’m very much of the “everyone driving slower than me is a time-sucking idiot and everyone driving faster than me is a maniac with a death wish” mentality, much to my girlfriend’s eternal frustration.

2990

I’m just sick of the old people buying sports cars and going under the speed limit. Or the adventurous Subaru owners who can almost venture to the speed limit. Or that weirdo Prime Prius model going around that doesn’t make the drivers go any faster than all the other Prius drivers…

Also we call people thieves, adulterers and scammers. We label the individuals who commit crimes all the time. Having said that, calling this particular group illegals really is an attempt to make them less human or not human at all so certain groups can dismiss anything that happens to them.