4541

Another favorite of yours I’m sure!

4542

So if one’s theories and philosophy are then used in some way by other people they then are directly responsible for the deaths and harm those other people cause. That is one of your central points, no?

4543

Now I wonder whose philosophy has not led to the deaths of millions? Obviously lots of people, because they propounded no philosophy. But if the people we know who did, which one is innocent of the death of millions?

4544

Not really. My central point is if you call for violence and terror and dictatorship and people follow up on those beliefs, you hold some responsibility.

4545

If you call for violence and terror, but not dictatorship, then you’re fine? Or just violence, with no terror or dictatorship? Is there terror-free violence?

4546

What an odd comment.

4547

So Jefferson, Marx, all monsters then?

4548

Not monsters, just culpable for their words and actions.

4549

Okay. Good. So then if anyone quotes Jefferson, or makes a metaphor or analogy to Jeffersonian thought or writings, or god forbid defends them, surely they should be challenged and have all the evils of the regime that followed his ideals explained to them and a demand made that that person denounce Jefferson and every last word he ever wrote as discredited. Just as has been done with Marx. Right?

4550

No, silly. Because Jefferson succeeded, and Marx failed. Keep up.

4551

I’m sorry but Marx is in his own words defending a lot of how communist regimes actually worked out. Violence? Check. Terror? Check. Dictatorship? Check.

4552

Jefferson had the terror-free violence.

4553

Marx had his violence/terror/dictatorship revolution! if only he lived to see them.

4554

Jefferson did! And he even got to continue a practice of chattel slavery!

4555

Hey I didn’t bring up Jefferson and I’m not here to defend him. I believe Scott brought him up. I will defend Jefferson from a hilarious comparison to Marx considering we are talking about Marx.

4556

I told you way up there ☝️that you were making a mistake by focusing your judgement of Marx on whether he advocated violence, and that it would lead you into a mess. Find something else about him to criticize. There must be something you see that distinguishes him from Jefferson, and it isn’t advocacy or use of violence. It’s something else. Focus on that something else.

4557

Do you perhaps understand why Scott brought him up? What he might have been trying to illustrate with the statement?

I notice you didn’t answer the question.

4558

Nah I’m good with calling Marx an advocate of violence.

Is a completely out of bounds comparison that should be refuted on it’s merits. I noticed no one refuted my analysis of Jefferson’s Tree of Liberty quote.

4559

You realize that your bit about the tree of liberty quote was addressed and the argument it strengthened wasn’t yours, right?

4560

Not really… but please elaborate!

Marx: “The Communists disdain to conceal their views and arms. They openly declare that their ends can be attained only by the forcible overthrow of all existing social conditions.”

Jefferson: " the remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon & pacify them. what signify a few lives lost in a century or two? the tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants.