A low blow, sir.
I think I spent most of the last half of the series wishing Spike would get over his chip, only to rip Buffy’s heart out and eat it. Now that would’ve been a great series ender!
As long as Xander goes first. He should have died with Buffy, never to return. His whole leaving-Anya-at-the-altar subplot was horrific bullshit. Leave Anya? Art thou daft, man? And then, because Whedon got into a tiff with the Emma Caulfield, he killed her off in the series finale in the most off-handed way he could think of, and had Xander chuckle to himself when told of it. WTF?
The show lost it when, against all forms of practical reason (within the setting of the show), Dawn did not ascend to Slayer status as Buffy’s understudy.
Of course, think of all the other super hero film writers. Heh, oops, I can’t think of any. And another problem is, Whedon’s writing without his direction can either turn out as the first X-Men film or the fourth Alien film. And his dialogue can either be snappy like Firefly’s (more likely) but sometimes, you get Faith’s eyerolling slang. I wanted to film a short film where Faith becomes a NYC detective and becomes NYPD Blue’s Andy Sipowicz’ partner.
“Dude, A: check the sitch here. Quite not 5 by 5. We better bug!”
“Let’s reach out to that mook skell dere den, and squeeze his shoes over that pros beating he went down for at Riker’s awhile back.”
NYPD Blue’s use of language remains unsurpassed. It’s like the two overly-verbose henchmen from Sin City made into series form.
Fantastic.
I would watch every single episode of a Sipowicz - Faith NYPD Blue spinoff show.
Yeah, the whole morality of the Buffyverse got extremely fucked with the whole Xander is Right to Leave Anya Because She Was Evil Once and Buffy is Right to Beat Spike Constantly (while fucking him on the side) Because He Was Evil Once.
Once you get to the point where the writing is telling you that evil = punishment forever even if you’ve reformed, then everyone in the series deserves to die because they’re all assholes.
I found the Xander/Anya thing was because Whedon is really fucked up about relationships and thinks all they ever bring is pain.
What he really should’ve done is have them get married, because he always stated that the show was a metaphor for life, and by that time, usually at least one of your friends gets married. Also, it would’ve shaken up the status quo a bit and given them new things to write about. But nooooooo…
Agreed, re: Dawn being slayer, BTW.
I tend to think that Fox did Whedon a big favor by killing Firefly when it did. It didn’t do the show any favors, mind you–it did the man’s PR a favor. Everyone loves an underdog, geeks especially when it’s THE BEST TELEVISION SHOW EVER that was CRUELLY PUT DOWN BY CORPORATE OVERLORDS–who were probably jocks or at least popular in high school.
If the show had remained on the air, perhaps in an alternate universe where the network’s management wasn’t apparently hostile to it, I’m pretty sure it would’ve gone the same directions of Buffy–a few good seasons, then pretty much leaping off the rails as he got distracted by other projects and left it to the hands of subpar writers (prosecution’s primary exhibit: “Heart of Gold”) with his periods of dashing back on-set to yank the steering wheel getting increasingly more spread out.
Good call, except it’s more like a 14 year old girl writing about what 11 year old boys say to each other when they play soldiers.
I did like Firefly and Serenity having been forced to watch 'em by my wife (a huge Whedon fan). His stuff is generally just too goofy and self-mocking for my tastes. It’s like a 14 year old’s D&D campaign of what a world is like, but he does do a good job with characters and dialogue.
Oh you have no idea the can of worms you just opened. And beside that can? An opened can of whoopass.
Maybe it’s time to recall that The Great Joss Whedon once wrote the script for Alien: Resurrection…
In the more important layer of nesting, it’s a grown man writing like what a 14 year old girl wishes she were clever enough to write about what she wishes 11 year old boys were clever enough to say to each other when they play soldiers (and gaze soulfully into each others’ eyes). It’s got that whole hook of reassuring aspiring fanfic writers that someday they can be as beloved if they just keep plugging away at that epic Buffy-Firefly crossover orgy novel.
Yeah, but it’s devoted geekfan whoopass. That brand’s like the Keystone Kops mistakenly being issued 99% empty cans of silly string in place of pepper spray, only that analogy’s too strained because the Keystone Kops are by and large in much better shape.
IT’S WHUP-ASS, GODDAMMIT!!! WHOOPING IS A COUGH OR A CRANE!!!
THIS IS WHUP, AS IN, I’M GOING TO TAKE MY BELT OFF AND GIVE YOU A WHUPPIN’!!!
aslkngaoiwfo023f0q238902
I thought he was just using a partially onomatopoeic variant.
I actually like Resurrection, because it’s one of the great WTF films of all-time. One-half of the Delicatessen team as a director? Ron Perlman? Brad Dourif??? Man, I’ll take that over the let’s-zoom-the-camera-while-it’s-upside-down-again! borefest of Alien 3 any day.
Could the folks who believe Joss is overrated give some examples of TV writers or directors that are consistently better? You folks have some points with which I agree – like the Anya/Xander fiasco – but I can’t think of any other television creative talent that has sustained my interest over multiple seasons.
Whedon is OK. I enjoyed Firefly and thought Serenity was a great wrap up to the unfinished series. He’s got geek cred, and he does “get it” about some things better than the average Hollywood director and producer. Still, he’s not the second coming of Gene Roddenberry or anything. Take Buffy and Angel for example. Best thing about both of those shows was a propensity to dress Charisma Carpenter in amazingly hot outfits on a weekly basis.
So Whedon’s hit or miss in my book. I bought Firefly on DVD, but no way I spend money on Buffy/Angel. I would however pay $20 for a DVD of Charisma modeling every outfit she ever wore on both series, but you know, that’s just me and my sick obsession.
So you’re not a fan of Astonishing X-Men then, I take it? I rather liked the first few issues until I got annoyed that the comic sub service I was using fucked up and missed one and it somehow happened to rocket up to a $20 price by the time I got around to trying to get it so gave up.
Seems like a lot of the anti-Whedon angst is coming from the late-Buffy watcher camp. I’m not sure that’s so much a rail against Whedon as it is against any show being allowed to continue to more or less 2x the original run it was obviously slated for. What do you get when you take the idea of “It must suck to have to deal with all the angst of high school while having all this responsibility” and then remove the angst of high school? Err… crap. People expected different?
Then again, the episodes of Angel I saw I really rather enjoyed, so wtf do I know?
For everyone using Buffy Seasons 6&7 as the bat to bash Whedon with, that’s actually when he was most hands off on the series. Most of the blame for those seasons can be laid at the feet of the showrunner during that time, Marti Noxon.