Joss Whedon? Seriously?

People thought Williamsom would be a great comic book film adaptation writer/director?

Bill: fwiw apparently a lot of Faith’s slang was Dushku’s doing. Especially after she made her return in the final season.

My favorite forum defense. Writing things disallows one from commenting on the quality of what others write.

Right, thus the sentence about it not doing the show itself any favors. We also would’ve received a world where the man didn’t have the same amount of yearning “anything this other dude did, Joss can do better!” song and dance routine. The show getting cut down did his PR wonders.

Fuck his PR, I’m not arguing his PR. You said it would also benefit Firefly/Whedon fans. Cutting the potential product by a fraction is not a benefit.

Also…drastic things happened in the movie? Deaths, sure, but people would’ve died in our subjunctive sweeping space saga, too–they probably just would’ve been dubiously resurrected later, that’s all.

“Deaths, sure.” Those don’t count as drastic, Drastic? I meant specifically the death of my favorite character so, yeah, your Marvel Comics No-Prize rationale notwithstanding, it bums me out some.

I haven’t seen Felicity, but Alias basically burned itself out after a season and a half. Two at the most. Whedon definitely had more success with Buffy / or Angel than Abrams had with Alias. Lost remains to be seen, but season 2 was definitely not as good as season 1 so that doesn’t bode well. All in all though I don’t think you can consider him as successful as Joss Whedon in keeping a show going well.

Sorkin had 4 good years on The West Wing. About comparable to Buffy and Angel.

People thought he would be a great teen horror movie writer/director before stuff like these.

Specifically though, Serenity was good in a comic book sort of way and it was his first movie. Why do people think that Joss Whedon wouldn’t be a good writer/director for comic book film adaptation?

None of those were all that terrible, for teen horror flicks IMO.

Specifically though, Serenity was good in a comic book sort of way and it was his first movie. Why do people think that Joss Whedon wouldn’t be a good writer/director for comic book film adaptation?

hey, there’s a whole subthread around here devoted to just that!

No doubt about that, but I believe that it’s much more difficult to sustain good quality over most or all of the run of a television series, much less to achieve critical acclaim across multiple shows. Chris Carter is a good example of a talented guy who had a few excellent seasons and then crashed and burned. That’s why I ruled out Sorkin – something, maybe substance use, caused his work on West Wing to drop in quality. I’m not a fan of Abrams, but many of my friends were. None of them had watched Alias the last one to two seasons, even though they tuned in for the series finale. Kelley is virtually guaranteed to give you 2-3 seasons of great TV, and then keep a pale shadow of the show running 2 seasons too long (see McBeal & LA Law)

I’m not trying to convince anyone of anything, but I found the quality of Whedon’s 3 shows – Buffy, Angel, and Firefly – to be consistently higher across their entire runs than others mentioned so far. For me, Milch is the strongest runner-up, although I need two more seasons of Deadwood to make a final judgment.

I admit I haven’t watched many of the shows Toddy mentioned; I’ll have to give them a try.

The only director who could have done Wonder Woman justice was Russ Meyer.

I can’t believe people are still giving Abrams credit for Lost. His only direct credits were in writing and directing the pilot. Almost immediately after the show aired he was off working on MI:3. Any praise or critiques of Lost should go to Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse.

And I really can’t believe that Steve mentioned Kevin Williamson. The guy was the flavor of the month a long time ago when Scream was all of the rage and Dawson’s Creek hit the air. Buffy hit the air around the same time and people are still talking about Whedon’s three shows while Williamson is pretty much a footnote at this point.

Now that’s a movie I’d like to see. It’d be “Wonder Woman in the Land of the Ultravixens.”

Whedon was not a good director in the early Buffy. You can see him figure it out over time in the progression from Buffy -> Angel -> Firefly though. He’s improving with every series.

Carlton Cuse was responsible for The Adventures of Brisco County, Jr. so he gets an “A” in my book.

Whole series is coming out on DVD, in case you didn’t know. Fun stuff.

Dude, that wasn’t defense, it was a cheap shot. (Also lame, but you know, you get what you pay for.)

Fuck his PR, I’m not arguing his PR. You said it would also benefit Firefly/Whedon fans. Cutting the potential product by a fraction is not a benefit.

Did I? Don’t think I did. I said it would benefit his PR–which is what I’m arguing, I don’t know what script you’re on. (I’ll grant that whatever script it is probably has wittier banter, so there is that.) I also said that if it hadn’t been cut down, there would’ve been a few good seasons (likely a rising curve; Kreskin says a second even better than the first, a third that hummed along, a fourth beginning to stumble and wander, a fifth on par with one, then a sort of slow-motion crash; I didn’t say that then, I’m saying that now in the parenthetical. I believed that then too, though).

“Deaths, sure.” Those don’t count as drastic, Drastic? I meant specifically the death of my favorite character so, yeah, your Marvel Comics No-Prize rationale notwithstanding, it bums me out some.

As someone who’s dead inside, I appreciate those whose hearts are flinty and unyielding, and take your word that yours can only be brought to pang by something momentous by definition.

Even so, nope, they don’t count. I would rate “drastic” as something that sufficiently changes the very state of the world–the ‘verse if you really MUST. Death come a’callin’ ain’t nothin’ but what we all got comin’ (pardner), and that holds especially true in a setting that purposefully rammed the sci-fi cookie into the jar of western peanut butter.

I’m guessing a No-Prize is the same sort of prize everyone gets for posting on a forum. In my case, another goddamn briefcase full of money. I’m running out of storage space, I’m telling you.

Sadly, even this is dumb bullshit. The secret origins of the reavers and Mal broadcasting it over the verse counts as drastic by your own dumb bullshit terms. Also sadly, it was corny and cliched and is probably the worst part of the movie other than the DVD cover.

I’d say the only thing it changed was backstory–in, yes, a rather goofy and dumb way, but hell, that’s Whedon for you.

In the alternate universe (two down, hang a left), the one where the flick was a runaway box office smash and Fox’s evil overlords committed seppuku in remorse (for Joss so loved the browncoats that he gave, etc.), the series was immediately restarted–and the setting required barely a change. The occasional reference to the Feds cracking down harder on the core worlds, a mite more unrest in the fringes–beyond that, nothing to keep a series from a sustainable steady-state.

That line, which almost derailed the entire movie near the end, was, of course, actually written by Whedon (who is an overrated hack).

And, you don’t have to search around too much on Google to find out that Whedon’s work on Toy Story was as a late stage “script doctor”. Not hardly the head writer as someone was claiming previously.

Since it came up again, The Usual Suspects was written by Christopher McQuarrie.

To be fair regarding the mister-wizards-fun-fact-about-toads-and-lightning line, it was destined to be emoted by Halle Berry. Shakespeare could have written it via ouija board, and it would be doomed from the start.

I’d be on the script you wrote, Muscles.

(I’ll grant that whatever script it is probably has wittier banter, so there is that.) I also said that if it hadn’t been cut down, there would’ve been a few good seasons (likely a rising curve; Kreskin says a second even better than the first, a third that hummed along, a fourth beginning to stumble and wander, a fifth on par with one, then a sort of slow-motion crash; I didn’t say that then, I’m saying that now in the parenthetical. I believed that then too, though).

Fuck Kreskin. Everyone knows geek TV shows peak in the 3rd season. Regardless, you yourself are arguing against your original statement, the one you decided to ignore or deny.

As someone who’s dead inside, I appreciate those whose hearts are flinty and unyielding, and take your word that yours can only be brought to pang by something momentous by definition.

My Hero.

Even so, nope, they don’t count. I would rate “drastic” as something that sufficiently changes the very state of the world–the ‘verse if you really MUST. Death come a’callin’ ain’t nothin’ but what we all got comin’ (pardner), and that holds especially true in a setting that purposefully rammed the sci-fi cookie into the jar of western peanut butter.

Nearly 1/4 of the main cast is no longer in it and the two biggest mysteries are solved/resolved so yes, definitively, the state of the world was sufficently changed.

I’m guessing a No-Prize is the same sort of prize everyone gets for posting on a forum. In my case, another goddamn briefcase full of money. I’m running out of storage space, I’m telling you.

Wow, you’re so cool and non-geeky. Can I rub your neck?