Kingpin via steam and redbook audio?

It was the actual vertices of the model wobbling, thanks to the low-precision numbers used by the Q2 engine to store vertices (memory and speed issues). I think the engine used integers for vertex data, which blows my 21st century mind.

What is disorienting about model wobbling? I liked it at a time : )

are you saying the gog version has the redbook audio tracks ? how ? the size is listed as 330mb. that does not make sense. i just looked at the original cd and the data size is 482,950,158mb (not counting the redbook which is not “data”). sure there was some small stuff they could have taken out (which i assume they have) like the 23mb demo directory, the 500kb ereg directory, the 1.6mb gamespy exe, and the 6.8mb heat directory. that still leaves kingpin data @448+mb. a full disc image with the tracks should be 800+mb. did they make the audio tracks into mp3’s ? but if so, they must have used some darn good compression to compress the data and tracks better then just the data was on the retail cd.

also about gog and redbook, i know that another such dos game, screamer, from gog does not have redbook audio. (unless they fixed it since i last checked.). and all the music tracks were redbook. playing screamer with no music is basically unplayable, because in those days there weren’t much sfx. these days i “race” without music, but that particular game needed the music so as not be silent. they could make an image of some kind that keeps the tracks and stream them off. if daemon tools/alcohol can do it so should they. they are supposed to be, mainly, about old games - like their name suggests. i don’t much like that they have what i consider new-ish games. ie far cry (2004) perimeter (2004) darkstar one (2006) . i don’t mind, but they should add more OLD titles from dos, not stuff still being sold now. one good yard stick would be if the game is over 1gb it’s too “new”. but, yeah, whatever.

In my GOG Kingpin release there is folder called “music” which contains 6 mp3 files, so my guess is that they indeed converted it to mp3.Works like a charm.

oh no not this shit again

so what ? they may have added the tracks as a “bonus”
do they actually play in-game ? that’s the question!!

who else has that issue for you to say “that shit again” ?

“Works like a charm” was intended to mean that YES, they work INGAME like a charm, sorry I was not clear. I just tested it to be 100% sure.

and I am tired of the people constantly complaining that gog is adding games that are not from DOS era, who are they to decide what is “old enough” ? more games on gog the better, no matter how old or new they are.

Oh no, you’re tired, how ever shall you go on?

If people are complaining about newish games on GOG, it’s most likely because they’re detecting the early stages of decay.

Show me where exactly did GOG define “old” and how they are breaching what they promised.Oh wait they didn’t.If they add game released in 2008, even that can be seen as old by some.

Some people’s “shit” is another person’s “pretty persausive fucking argument”.

I’m one of those folks who thinks that GoG spews out way too much not-old Eurotrash shovelware, but occasionally redeems themselves with actual old classic stuff.

I am sure they are trying to get as many classics as possible, so I am just willing to give them some slack for releasing old-but-not-decade-old games.

And they did already released Fallout anyway.

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2020-01-17-3d-realms-revives-1999-pc-shooter-kingpin

Remaster incoming! I’m actually kind of interested. Everything from that era of Interplay was different and kind of unique.

“Kingpin doesn’t get the recognition it deserves, due to unfortunately releasing in an era when games were blamed for societal problems,” said Frederik Schreiber, founder of the current version of 3D Realms.

“Current version?”

I don’t recall this being a very good game in the first place.

Those early Quake-engine swimming textures were something special in Kingpin.

And they’ve kept them for the remaster! It looks fucking shit.

My understanding is that it’s an artifact of the vertex compression system used in Quake 2 engine games. That engine didn’t support skeletal animation, so basically every frame of character animation was its own model. So, not fixable without an engine upgrade and redoing every animation from scratch.

I finished Kingpin back in the day. The thing I remember it being most notable for was using the word “fuck.” A lot. People would open doors and start shooting at you while screaming, “Fuuuuuuccker.” It was supposed to feel gritty and adult themed but I think it was mostly just funny.

It tried some interesting stuff with letting you interact with characters in ways other than killing them. Kind of novel for an FPS at the time but nothing special at all today. Plus that trailer doesn’t look good at all.

All integer (!), and not floating-point based UV mapping. 'Cause FP was all like slow and stuff back in the Second Age.

The renderer interpolating the vertex data in realtime is what causes the swimming artifacts in the first place, so I doubt speed was the overriding consideration. But since the animation system required storing sometimes dozens of slight variations of each model, storage space would have been a huge consideration. So they used a lossy compression scheme that represents each vertex as three short integers and an index into an array of precomputed 3D offsets to nudge the vertex closer to its “actual” position. Basically 3:1 compression compared to storing each vertex as three 4-bytes floats.

http://tfc.duke.free.fr/coding/md2-specs-en.html

Vertices are composed of “compressed” 3D coordinates, which are stored in one byte for each coordinate, and of a normal vector index. The normal vector array is stored in the anorms.h file of Quake 2 and hold 162 vectors in floating point (3 float ).

To uncompress vertex coordinates, you need to multiply each component by the scale factor and then add the respective translation component:

MD2 models are frame-by-frame animated. A frame is a screenshot of an animation. To avoid jerky and ugly animations, we use linear interpolation between vertex coordinates of two consecutive frames (the current frame we are drawing and the next frame).

Yikes. No doubt considered an acceptable solution back when everyone was running at 640x480. And of course more intended for quick running/walking/death animations, not the slow, closeup, cinematic use that Kingpin forced it into.

Did this game require the CD to be in the drive for the red book audio to be played?

What’s the count?

I said what’s the muthuf***n’ count?

@rei I am pretty sure the original game did, like Quake and Quake 2.

I’d shell out for a remaster of this. Also Anachronox, please.