I didn’t see anything in there that looked like he was agreeing with truthers, I don’t know where that is even coming from.
I actually struggled with the same thing Krugman wrote. I thought that it would be appropriate for me to reflect on 9/11 a decade later, but I kept coming back to the fact that the US is worse off in almost entirely every way. About the only positive legacy of 9/11 I can think of is armored cockpit doors. The event really was poisoned.
Who actually said that Krugman should be banned? Or are you just making up headlines in order to paint those you disagree with in the worst possible light?
Everything else might suck, but on Armistice Day we get some hot Skyrim action.
I DON’T THINK KRUGMAN IS A TRUTHER IN ANY SENSE. THAT’S WHAT I SAID. I SAID I DO NOT BELIEVE HE IS A TRUTHER, BUT THAT A LOT OF THE PEOPLE IN THE COMMENTS WERE USING HIS WORDS AS THOUGH (AS THOUGH) HE WERE A TRUTHER CONFIRMING THEIR VIEWS.
I just want to make that clear, in case you, like Jason, think I am accusing Krugman of something here.
hand over eyes
I didn’t say you thought he was a truther. As Alstein pointed out it was weird that you made a statement like “I’d like to think he isn’t a truther” when there was no reason for you or anyone to have to say so. It’s like saying “I’d like to think Robert Sharp isn’t a car thief” before discussing some car thieves who once commented on something you wrote. That kind of disclaimer doesn’t sound very favorable to the person it exculpates from whatever.
Admit it, you guys are all Truthers.
Why do you keep saying that?
Holy crap you’re right, Krugman is a truther! He said it right there!
Well geez, just because Krugman’s a truther, is there something WRONG with that?
Damnit! I’m cold busted!
(Jason, I just didn’t word it very well. Instead of ‘I’d like to think’ I should have put ‘I don’t think he is a truther, but some of his followers seem to be!’)
Krugman is off the mark here:
The American government’s reaction to 9/11 is shameful only in hindsight. If the domination of Iraq and Afghanistan had gone better, which was reasonable to conclude based on the might of the US military, even the American people would have applauded. The attempted domination of Vietnam offers a complete corollary - it was only when the costs of the war began mounting without benefits apparent to the American people that substantial popular resistance formed against the war. The American people themselves are corrupt and complicit with the actions of both American corporations and the American government.
The “American Way”, after all, is about imperial domination of the world with the proceeds of that domination used to fuel an American “middle class” built on living in homes more similar to castles, bigger and bigger television sets, etc. Americans aren’t against imperialism, they are just against misguided imperial projects.
Of course there will come a day when Americans in fact ARE against imperialism, but, just as in England, that will only happen when America is no longer an empire, no longer reaping the benefits of domination. Beware, because many Americans will then claim they were against imperialism all along. Perhaps China (or more likely, an Asian Bloc) will be the new imperial masters and Americans the terrorists, and China will fight a “war on terror” against anyone and everyone who objects to their plan for world domination.
By the way - hi. I used to be on this messageboard before the greatest games reviewer in the world (but not the greatest person) called Tom Chick banned me.
Uh…
If you are indeed Brian Koontz, prove it by explaining to me what your ideal porn would be.
I’m not sure that shameful is really a useful word to describe the situation in any case, as it turns it into more of an ideological debate/blame festival than an assessment of consequences for strategic decisions. It’s also possible to be a blunt advocate of American imperialism and still see the Iraq and Afghanistan decisions, along with many of the domestic policies, as poorly and in many cases dishonestly planned and executed. Not bad or dishonest relative to public image or rhetoric, but dishonest in terms of specific policy goals that were not being well served by these decisions.
In any case, the social compact that you brand the American Way has clearly outworn its shelf life, as the current top-down class war makes clear. That, along with the potential consequences of these failed wars for the US place in the food chain over time, does imply an acceleration of trends towards the multipolar, post-Soviet world that was always in the pipeline. I think your “there will come a day” prediction regards the Chinese model as too stable, but as Russia or China can show you in any public opinion poll there’s no prerequisite that anti-imperialism arise in any dominant form just because you aren’t on top. If anything, the trend seems to be that getting the shit knocked out of you in a war or two with domestic fronts seems to bring about that kind of humility, and even then it’s a transient, easily damaged thing.
But it’s valuable, and when founded in reason and evidence-based thinking, worth taking seriously and arguing for rather than waging nerd skeptic warfare against it when it arises.
I sort of agree, weirdly. if there wasn’t a human factor involved.
Seems like the Twin Towers disaster ( I prefer that to 9/11) is used to mourn the death of the 3000 or so that died in the actual attack, and that is cool. However I just cannot help mourn the hundreds of thousands who have died and millions of lives that have been devastated in the name of the Towers.
Hey Saddam is dead though! The Taliban are ousted from power!The streets of the Western World are safe and secure!
And this is weird too because Saddam was genuinely a bastard (but he is OUR bastard), and the Taliban are genuinely horrible fundamentalist women hating bastards (not OUR bastards). So as someone who despises these people I should feel happy.
I don’t, because of the cost to real people who love their children and just want to live their lives in peace without worrying about those children or their friends or relatives being killed.
I hear about soldiers dying, see their faces, their families faces, but that doesn’t mean that some twelve year old in Afghanistan who is knocked out by a drone attack as “collateral” doesn’t exist, doesn’t have a face.
Anyway people are dicks and the cycle continues, welcome back to the board Koontz, I remember you from years ago.
I don’t think this is actually Koontz. I’ve never known Koontz to make grammatical errors.
Welcome? Back? Brian?
All we need now is Cleve. I wonder if his fallout shelter has wireless.
Well Cock a Doodle Doo.