guppy
3721
Kind of outclassed. She’s fun though.
People often build her pure support, I think that is a mistake though.
maxle
3722
I’m not taking Doran’s on Irelia versus someone with reasonably strong burst (Renekton, Jax) anymore, because what ends up happening is we trade damage, I can’t quite kill them and then I’m stuck with 20 hp/5 while they guzzle down health pots. If I don’t get a decent gank, I’m then fucked. Think I’m going T-shirt and pots against that sort of lane from now on, building into Wriggle’s, then TF.
Or boots. I confess to liking Q at lvl 1 so I can hang back and pick off last hits safely. And it keeps them scared. Then W, W, E, then R>W>Q>E. I sometimes like to level E before W when I am being pushed hard as the damage on E can be chunky and keeps people shy of tower diving… At least I like to think so.
maxle
3724
I have no idea why anyone would be scared of Irelia’s q?
Volbard
3725
Played a bit today for the first time in several months. It went about how you’d expect. I felt really clumsy, like I was holding the mouse upside down. If my ELO was decaying, it wasn’t decaying fast enough. I need to be bumped down about ten levels.
Well, that combined with e and w and then running away can net you a nice wee burst on someone. Seeing Irelia zip about the place keeps people on their toes.
Anyway, Since she has to melee to last hit I like a point in Q at level 1 to provide that killing assurity right from the get-go.
bluemax
3727
She’s not terrible, but she has a pretty high skill cap for a support champ.
Daoc had a few that I can remember
This is a great track well covered
Not having a weak early game? When was the last time you played Rammus?
With regards to doing damage, for Lane Rammus, if your opponent is properly last-hitting and not pushing the lane, taunt into turret is out which leaves you with how well your lane partner can work with your taunting. This can work out but usually it doesn’t, especially cause it needs at least three points in it before you can get much use out of it. Your Q rarely hits anyone because of all the minions and only exposes you for harass. The same kind of harass that can put you in low health with only two to three shots if you don’t W at the right moment. Regrowth Pendant/Doran’s Shield is pretty much the only viable starting item for Lane Rammus unfortunately. And don’t even get me started on his farm ability which is close to nothing in lane.
Jungle Rammus is better but still weak. If you are up against a Lee Sin or Trundle who decided to counter jungle you early on, you get murdered. Period. It’s not for nothing that Rammus is only a T4 jungler on Stonewall’s list. Lane ganking is pretty much the only thing he’s good at.
TL;DR Lane Rammus bad, Jungle Rammus better. Neither very good early game.
Anyway, with regard to the carry context, I was talking about Rammus as a tank. Ganking with Jungle Rammus has nothing to do with tanking.
Rammus as a damage sponge is simply not viable until late midgame. In early game his taunt is still too short to make a difference. Not much benefit from passive because you won’t be wearing much armor nor from your W, which is still lacking points. And sure you could have armor in the early midgame if it wasn’t for the fact that Rammus early health is so poor you pretty much have to start midgame with some kind of health item like a gbelt. Or else be obliterated by enemy champs with even the slightest of feed.
This opposed to his late game where you can walz into a group fight in your W, which combined with your end game gear gives you near 80% damage reduction. Passive is now giving you 100+ damage and the now maxed 3 sec taunt makes sure that damage is applied repeatedly. Hell, I usually get a Phantom Dancer on Rammus in the end game because five slots for defensive items is already more then enough. I made escapes with two endgame geared dps hammering on me just because they couldn’t do enough damage to breach W and the hp regen fast enough.
TL;DR To suggest that Rammus has a game that doesn’t scale substantially of gear and levels is something I can’t even begin to grasp.
Most demoralizing game I ever played had me laning against a Shen and Rammus who would alternate taunts perfectly anytime they got near me. Felt about as ineffectual as possible.
Um. Lane Rammus? Such a fantastical beast does not exist! Or should not, anyway :p
As you say he’s better in the Jungle (tho no longer a great jungler) and his pub-stompyness is grand - and doesn’t require items as the guys are saying (they’re not thinking of lane Rammus).
I love helping my lvl 16 friend, 20/4/20… troloolololo! I am teaching him good stuff though…
guppy
3733
Everyone scales substantially off gear and levels. But the term “carry” means someone who will “carry” the team to victory if allowed to get fat. Rammus does not do this.
And if your passive is giving you 100+ damage, either you’re an idiot, or the other team are. Probably both. That would require you to have 400+ armor.
Lane Rammus is pretty bad, it’s true! Jungle Rammus has been nerfed, which makes him a subpar pick for the reasons you describe. (But most of the champions are subpar picks, which is why you tend to see similar bans and picks in most competitive games. And if you’re picking Rammus at all, you’re accepting that you’ll have to deal with this.) But his ganking early game is fine and not especially item-reliant.
By that definition, no. But by saying ‘tank carry’ I ment needing gear and levels to reach maximum potential for tanking. And I don’t just mean in stats, I mean in utility.
And of course everyone scales. The point is that there is a set of champs that can kill people rather effortlessly from lvl 1 onward while becoming weaker later (unless they snowball) and a set of champs that can’t punch a hole in a wet newspaper until they reach a certain level of farm.
My point is that Rammus is one in the second category, especially seeing his intended purpose (tank).
There is also a certain set of champs that can kill or carry out their intended purpose regardless of level but those shall not be named.
And if your passive is giving you 100+ damage, either you’re an idiot, or the other team are. Probably both. That would require you to have 400+ armor.
Base armor: 86
Runes + talents: 15-20
W: 150
TM or FH: 100
Wriggles: 30
That’s 381-386 armor with only one dedicated major armor item. This is assuming you take Mercs instead of Tabi (which one should) or you would have over 400 already. Otherwise, getting a Sunfire or even an Aegis will put you above 400.
Never assume your W is always up.
Of course not. It was just to show that getting 400+ armor on Rammus isn’t hard at all and certainly does not require crazy builds or anything.
SlyFrog
3737
Maybe - I split utility and defensive (with a point in +5 gold per smite).
fire
3738
Can someone explain, with some fancy maths or a pretty picture, how damage is calculated in LoL?
maxle
3740
Which is more than enough for something like 98% of the player base, as counter-jungling isn’t exactly a regular occurrence at 14-1600 elo, nevermind lower.
Rammus as a damage sponge is simply not viable until late midgame.
This is true of lots of tanks.
