3121

Manamune is great on sivir.

It’s great and all that her SS can absorb mana, but vs certain opponent, you either can’t absorb fast enough or unable to absorb at all. once you get manamune, your mana problem is over, you can keep ricochet up permanently, and I keep it up simply combining ricochet + boomerang means you can keep harassing enemy without getting close to the front.

Also manamune add easily over 60-70 attack(it only cost 2200 or so, one the best cost effective item) due to how easily it is to gain mana just from auto attack.

Getting mana regen item early also mean you can harass more, which means less farm for your opponent, with sivir in mid without any mana problem, it’s so easy to keep pressure on an opponent’s tower, they often have to call in gank or support from side lane to support the middle, which leave side lane open for easy push.

3122

Play it, that game will drum out any feelings of love pretty quickly :)

3123

Nasus is absolutely wasted in the jungle and should only be there if no-one else can jungle.

3124

Nasus’ Q should scale per point put into it. Like 2/4/8/16 or something. As it is now, I tend to get one level of it just get the bonus for killing minions but not for any serious reason.

3125

Considering I can already get it to +100 to +150 a game that would be crazy.

3126

Nasus is wasted in a lane and should only be there if no one else can lane.

This is fun.

3127

Nasus shouldn’t solo but instead be in a duo lane, just use Q to last hit, it’s better and fast than jungling, and less chance of harass than staying in a solo lane.

3128

to be more constructive, is he wasted soloing because his W is so effective at preventing people from fleeing? Or that his E is effective at farming and last hit denial?

So far the only two jungle champs I’ve seen is Warwick and Irelia, I’m surprised their aren’t more people attempting it with different champs. Nunu looks like he could probably jungle effectively.

3129

He’s okay. Olaf, Yi and Fiddle can, also. Amumu can jungle fairly well, too, though I’ve never seen one on my team. Attack Speed is what’s important, so try to use Red AS runes for it, and of course the neutral buff mastery. Three red armor pen runes will help with golems, too (that’s exactly the amount needed to pen its armor). IMHO, keep up with the duo lane, be ready to ambush the lanes at level 4 and maintain control of dragon. If you can do all that, you are golden.

3130

Kirian mained Nasus (along with Sivir) for god know’s how long and know’s his stuff. I have no doubt that if you look him up he’ll talk with you at length about the subject, as he did with me, oh so long ago :)

I can only assume that he didn’t write an essay in the thread because he wasn’t bothered, and I don’t blame him.

Also Idrisz, we’ve had this discussion before. Manamune really isn’t that great on Sivir. It only procs with your Q and auto-attack and you’ll never come close to a full charge in a game.

3131

I just disagree here. The AD bonus can be more beneficial than the MR bonus from Chalice depending on the game, and with either item Sivir does not have mana issues. I also spam the hell out of Boomerang Blade.

3132

If your giving advice for jungling Nunu, your doing it all wrong. Nunu jungles through the use of consume and not auto-attacking creeps like most others.

And Amumu’s a great jungler but you really do need a proper rune/mastery set-up to make it work (which is why i don’t do it with you guys).

3133

Heaven forbid you describe the proper setup.

3134

Health Quints, MPen red, dodge yellow, Mp regen/5 blue.

1/9/20 or something for masteries. Start with the crying skill.

I dunno, this is just a guess. If you go on youtube and search <champion name> jungle there’s a guy with video guides for every champion.

3135

Don’t take Dodge on Amumu. Flat health or armor is better so you can spam tantrum more once you get decent mana regen.

Also, Udyr is a great jungler and Shen is good too. Yi is pretty good. Akali is competent with the right set up. Xin is good but he’s really good in lane so it’s a bit of a waste. Morgana can with a specialized set up. Most champs technically can jungle with the right set ups, but those are the better ones along with the ones mentioned before. I may be forgetting a few.

3136

I disagree.
Dodging even a single hero attack in a team fight (80-300 damage, depending on hero) is more valuable than .5 seconds less cooldown on his aoe damage skill IMO.

3137

Well, I played 3 manamune sivir games tonight. I typically got the Manamune between the 12th and 15th minutes (and typically could afford it closer to 12th). All side lane.

Sivir has, if I have looked this up right, 977 mana at level 18. In all 3 games I was easily hitting 1800+ mana and typically close to 2000 (I don’t think I hit max level in every game, so the numbers are fudged a little bit by that. I think I was level 15-18 in the games). Again, if these numbers are right, Sivir + fully stacked manamune is 2350 mana. So no, I’m not filling up (none of these games went past 30-35 minutes, iirc). I’d say I was getting 600-800 mana from procs in those games.

That said, the build seems rather interesting. I am typically getting Manamune in the 12th-15th minute. I rarely had mana issues from that point on. My runes aren’t optimized but I was running 6 blue mp5/s. My damage seems to quickly approach 150. Beserker’s greaves and a BF sword later, and I’m easily clearing 200 damage (with a tidy attack speed to boot; I am often at 210-220 at this point). The spike in farming at that point snowballs things. In all 3 games I easily got a 2nd Bloodthirster. The attack speed from berserkers is an enemy of maxing procs, to be sure, but then it’s more important in team fights. I didn’t team fight that well or I think I would have had some great games, kill count wise.

I am going to try it some more. The manamune, when purchased at the times I was getting it, is a +40 damage item (I am usually at 900+ from the bonus 350 mana at that point) with the passive. And the extra mana is really useful.

3138

Let’s go over the items:
Tear of the goddess:
+350 Mana +7 Mana Regen per 5 sec UNIQUE Passive: Each time your Champion uses an Ability their Maximum Mana will increase by 4 Mana, up to a maximum of twice in a six second period; bonuses cap at +1000 Mana.

BB doesn’t activate tear, so you only gain + mana when you throw your Q. Your +mana gain is minimal until you have manamune.

When you finally have the farm for manamune (2110 gold, and you need at least level 1 boots before then, so let’s say 2460) On a good game, would you estimate this to be 12-15 minutes, if you do very well?

Manamune:
+350 Mana +7 Mana Regen per 5 sec +20 Attack Damage UNIQUE Passive: 2% of your max mana is converted to attack damage. UNIQUE Passive: Each time you attack, you gain one maximum mana (3 second cooldown.) Each time you use an ability …

At this point, your Q is still giving you 4 mana per throw, and auto attacking is giving you maybe 20 mana per minute MAX. It will now take you 50 minutes (at maximum speed) to use auto attacks to fill your mana. Let’s say you throw about 2 Q’s per minute (160 mana a minute usage, which would mean you need runes etc to keep up, and in addition to the 7mp5, and you aren’t using bouncing blades), that’s a whopping extra 8 mana per minute you’re accumulating. Let’s say you did that for the 12 minutes you were farming - that’s 96 mana (or 1/10th of the way there.) So, in this case you’ve got a very long way to go before manamune comes to full potency.

In most games, you will not farm that fast, nor will you auto attack every 3 seconds to proc manamune.

This is the same problem ashe has, where she can have a 4 second volley time, but can’t proc manamune enough to make it better than just buying a BF sword.

I’d rather have my AD and mana regen up quickly via a BF sword and a meki for 2240, and have that big damage boost at the 15 minute mark.

3139

I did some jungling with ad sion today and it worked out pretty well. Seemed to be about the same speed as master yi.

3140

Mana regen Yellows and Flat CDR Blues are what I use (along with what you already said), along with a 9/4/17. This lets you grab a Dorans shield to start instead of cloth armor and still grab the blue at the beginning (starting with W and Smite).

Also Jim, thanks for having my back while I slept. I really didn’t wanna have to say all that as bleary eyed as I am :)