4861

I think its the most excited about a change I’ve been in awhile.

I do it because I’m terrible at spell shielding and Sivir can quickly farm up a Warmogs. Still if you’re not farming fast then it probably isn’t worth it because it delays your ability to get damage.

I don’t play much Sivir though.

@Pogo: I like the mirror match ideas. And the idea of having other people jungle. Seems like Bunny, Lazy and I are the only ones really comfortable at playing junglers.

It gives you 3 characters who don’t have to compete with a lane mate for CS (ie Gold and EXP), which means 3 champs who are going to get their items a lot quicker. It also frees one character up to help gank as well as place wards to prevent ganks. And you can start trying to control dragon relatively early which is really important (although less so than it used to be).

4862

As far as I recall, Rammus didn’t even get a big buff to make him OP. It was more the nerfing other champs (Shen, Garen, Mord etc.) that made him popular. So it would suck if they nerf him hard since there aren’t even that many tanks to choose from in the game.

4863

They switched his scaling on his W to scale off armor instead of AP like 6 months ago and then he pretty much wasn’t touched since until the recent nerf barrage. Really seems like this all came about with the community at large discovering Jungle Rammus.

4864

I’m finding conflicting info on jungle Udyr. It seems Phoenix was the big thing and then it got nerfed, so now people are considering Tiger? Which one does more DPS against minions/champs? It’s obvious that Tiger is prime for taking down turrets, but it didn’t seem like it should be that bad for ganking either.

4865

My first game as ashe in a while last night, my first 4 assists were arrows from mid. It’s possible, especially if someone just stands there farming. The advice is often “shoot right behind the caster minions”, because people are often there last hitting (if they are ranged.) Just ping and fling.

One game I had with the EU guys, I got 1 kill and 1 assist off one arrow, fired right behind their bot tower from mid - that’s some tasty, tasty gold.

4866

Phoenix gives you your highest theoretical DPS, but only if you can hit them with all 3 strikes (not always possible in a chase situation) if you can’t then Tiger will do more damage. Also late game Tiger is your optimal DPS stance because of the high boost it gets from items as opposed to Phoenix.

You can jungle with both Phoenix and Tiger, both of which are quite fast (he’s one of the fastest junglers in the game) but Phoenix does still work out to be faster then Tiger with a difference of about 20 - 30 seconds with optimal Rune setups. So it’s really up to you, and what track you want to take him down to be honest.

4867

I’ve tried both, and Tiger actually allowed me to kill fast enough to have about 75% health, which would be much more optimal to go gank at level 3 or 4 than Phoenix. However, both of my practices have been taking Tiger or Phoenix, I didn’t try starting out with turtle yet to see if that would make it easier. With Smite and Turtle, perhaps I could finish Blue with even more mana/health than before.

I can see the appeal of Phoenix, but testing on Dragon I got better DPS out of Tiger.

4868

What runes are you using? You should be clearing the jungle over 60% health regardless. He’s an extremely strong jungle champion and one of the reasons for that is that he never gets low thanks to turtle.

Also, even if you plan on maxing turtle first you still need to take either Phoenix or Tiger first if you plan on starting at the Blue (which you should be).

All my info comes from Stonewall who’s considered LoL’s foremost expert on all things jungle related.

4869

we figure out why bunny sucked at jungling, he was running a 9/0/21 mastery, except he doesn’t have archaeic mastery for 9th points…

instead he put it into some shitty .2 ability per level…

4870

Dodge/MP5 yellows (don’t have armor yellows yet), MR blues, Arpen reds, 2xArpen quints with 1xhealth quint.

21/0/9

4871

Sounds good to me (as you’ve probably noticed, I doubt you have any problems jungling), although your pretty insane to run dodge runes without at least the defensive masteries :)

But check out Stonewall’s Udyr stuff, he knows his stuff. Tiger probably gives you more DPS with a 21 offense build, I tend to build my udyr a bit more tanky (don’t max Tiger till I’ve maxed out Turtle and Phoenix, with a point in Bear), building Randuins and Merc threads as my first items and then going back for a Trinity Force. I don’t get Madrads on him at all, Phoenix makes it unnecessary.

4872

I usually run 1/18/11 on Udyr, start with Phoenix, get Turtle second, 1 point in bear at level 4 for the stun, and then later 1 point in Tiger before finishing Phoenix and Turtle. I now max out Tiger instead of Bear.

I find Phoenix is better early game, especially for blue buff and Tiger is better late game.

I think this is how Wikd plays Udyr. I know on items he also starts with Heart of Gold and gets Aegis second. His logic was that he wants to finish Aegis around level 9 so that his team can start winning dragon fights. Having Aegis really early makes it easier for your team to win the dragon fights.

Of course dragon control isn’t as emphasized in lower level games, but its still a good starting combo.

4873

That’s exactly my build. Although the couple of times I used him we had an Aegis spoken for already on my team.

4874

Hrm, I was going Madreds, but I suppose with teammates instead of bots, the stun is the most important factor for the gank and not the damage.

4875

If you level Tiger then I’m pretty sure Madrads is neccesary (the little ones that is, never get the full Razors on Udyr turn it into Wriggles instead). And yes, at least 1 point in Bear is mandatory for ganking.

4876

Does anyone make it a habit of watching streams of LoL? Anyone have any good streams they could suggest? I typically go to Livestream and search for a random LoL feed, but the quality is soso.

Thanks.

~C~

4877

So what do people think, is the new Ryze going to be super OP when he hits? I kind of feel that he is and that it’s even by design, Ryze is the LoL poster boy and also the character with the most skins, so…

4878

Yeah this is a bit old but I’ve been playing a ton of him lately. Elementz, the maker of tier lists, puts him tier 2 so there’s that. I’ve finally think I’ve gotten a good handle on him in regards to itemization and playstyle. My last 3 games with him were all victories and I went

11/5/11
4/2/6 (early surrender)
15/7/14

So I’m feeling he’s pretty decent. I’ve been going Doran’s Shield to start, followed by the CDR boots. Then brutalizer and avarice blade, but don’t finish ghost blade for a while. Next I grab Spirit Visage, then Sunfire, then finish Ghost Blade, then get a Bloodthirster and then if it goes past that some random AD or Def item depending on the game. Been running tanky runes and something like 14/16/0 for masteries. Sunfire synergizes really well with his ult, 15 seconds of 140 aoe damage per tic is nothing to sneeze at. The big change I made to my build was dumping Phage which I had been picking up early.

4879

Renekton sucks. And so do his sound effects.

You should learn Xin Zhao.

4880

Xin is not an Albino Space Crocodile.

I like the way Ren plays more than Xin. I’ve also won 1v1s against Xin so :P, but honestly there are a lot of really bad Xins out there.

And like I said, the maker of lists, puts Xin and Renekton fairly close together, though does give the edge to Xin.