5241

So maybe this deserves its own thread, but I was browsing Gamasutra just now and saw this on the press wire:

LAS VEGAS, NV – February 22, 2011 – Petroglyph Games, Inc.™ (Petroglyph) today announced Rise of Immortals,™, an online, free-to-play PC game that expands on the hit Multiplayer Online Battle Arena (MOBA) genre with new, innovative features designed to appeal to both core and casual players.

A new challenger approaches! Sounds like they’re borrowing ideas from both HoN (Champions are divided into Strength/Agility/Intelligence categories) and LoL (F2P, microtransactions, some sort of persistent growth system), while promising some kind of new PVE stuff.

I signed up for the Beta that is coming up. One thing that bothers me a bit from their site is how suspiciously familiar some of their 2D art looks. I realize its all just cribbing WC3, but some of it looks a lot like LoL, especially the Victory notification at the end of a match.

5242

There really isn’t enough room for yet another carbon copy of DotA. The only way someone is going to get my attention is if they take the basic formula of skill-leveling champs and put it on a playing field that isn’t exactly the fucking same. Although hey, it looks like they have two maps! Wow, incredible!

5243

They also have a persistent interactive social lobby!

Also it sounds like the more you play a champion the more powerful they become for you. There is no way in hell that can be balanced, and also I hate the idea of encouraging people to “main” a character in this type of game.

5244

The graphics and animation seemed nice until you realize that it’s actually very wooden and repetitive.

I don’t play LoL for the animations, I play for how tight it feels.

5245

The info might be a bit dated but the General Guides section has some of what you are looking for:

http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=68225

There is this guy breaking down the math which might not be totally accurate but gives you an idea:

http://leaguecraft.com/strategies/gameguide/133

P.S. What he calls Spell Damage (SD) is actually commonly called AP.

5246

I feel like this was an issue with the Dawn of Wars, they have all these sync kill animations, but hardcore players don’t care, they don’t have time to watch fancy animations, they’re busy multitasking.

PS. I really hate how they will add an item to LoL, but then not update any of the guide or tree portion. I didn’t even know Morello’s Tomb existed until I saw someone else build it, and you can’t just click you’re way up the item tree to build it, you have to find the Tomb entry to build towards it.

5247

Here’s a couple of random noob questions that I’ve wondering about for a while but keep forgetting to ask and also a more specific question about Olafing:

Sometimes people talk about whether a kill trade is worth it or not. How much are kills and assists worth in gold? Does the value of killing someone go up only if they’re on a kill streak or is it based on their total kills in the game so far? If three people kill another champion does only one person get an assist or do both of them?

Is there a champion stat spreadsheet or sortable table on a web page somewhere? In particular I was wondering who has the longest and shortest ranged attacks or if they’re all the same but I wouldn’t mind comparing other stats.

Sometimes people say that certain items don’t stack bonuses. What are the rules about what does and doesn’t stack?

What should I be doing in team fights as Olaf? I played a game with him yesterday that started out great, I think I was 4/0/5 by level 12 but then things went downhill when we started getting into the serious team fights. I had mostly been playing ranged guys until yesterday so when Olaf got all up in the shit it was hard to figure out what the heck was going on and then I was dead. I feel like I really let Olaf down and I make it one of my primary life goals to not upset people with nicknames like “The Berserker.”

5248

Oh I know this one!

Everything stacks unless an effect is listed as “UNIQUE ACTIVE” or “UNIQUE PASSIVE.”

5249

The bounty goes up with the kill streak, not the total amount of kills. I’d say the trade is worth it if one of the players is on a killing spree and the other isn’t, if it leads to taking down a tower or grabbing dragon, if one of the players is using a snowball item and it wipes some of their stacks. This is all entirely subjective though.

Sometimes people say that certain items don’t stack bonuses. What are the rules about what does and doesn’t stack?

If you look at the item listing it will say UNIQUE for some of its stats. This is item specific and not bonus specific, so two different items can have cooldown reduction which stacks with each other but not with themselves. For instance, Sunfire Capes AOE damage used to not be unique so people would buy multiple ones to get a lot of armor health and AOE, three sunfires would add up to 120 damage per second. This was changed so the AOE was unique so now three Sunfires adds up to only the base 40 damage per second.

5250

Kills are worth, at a baseline, 300 gold. First blood is 400, I think. Anyone who hurts a champion in the last few moments of that champion’s life get an assist, iirc (except the killer, who gets a kill). Outside of first blood, it is true the only way to get more gold for killing someone is if they are on a streak. The more a champion dies, the less gold they become worth.

Also note gold isn’t the only consideration. It is often (standard caveat; each situation is unique) worth it to trade a kill to get an enemy who is stacking something. I’m thinking of things like Soulstealer (not so much Bloodthirster, but it is nice to chop that off of a carry who is double stacking thirsters).

Is there a champion stat spreadsheet or sortable table on a web page somewhere? In particular I was wondering who has the longest and shortest ranged attacks or if they’re all the same but I wouldn’t mind comparing other stats.

Definately not all the same. At level 18 Trist is longest AFAIK, as that’s her passive (range goes up as she levels). Annie’s auto attack is really long. Cait has good range too. Teemo has one of the shortest ranged attack (his Q is significantly longer ranged).

Sometimes people say that certain items don’t stack bonuses. What are the rules about what does and doesn’t stack?

That’s different from “bonuses stacking”. Attack damage from any and all items that provide bonus attack damage stacks. An IE + a Black Cleaver is + 130 total damage (75+55).

However, many items provide bonuses that count as “unique”. Unique bonuses don’t stack. The most famous example is the Sunfire Cape; it does magic damage per second to everyone in close proximuty of the wearer. It used to be you oculs stack these to hilarious effect; Garen’s would just build Sunfires and between that and spin they could annihilate people. But it’s a unique bonus now; you only benefit from one where the magic damage is concerned. OTOH, the health and armor from multiple sunfires does stack (I think it’s +450 health and +45 armor per cape). Another example is Infinity Edge. Two Infinity Edges would give +150 damage and +40% crit chance. But you would still only get 250% critical damage, as it is a unique bonus.

5251

Sweet, thanks all the imfo.

OK, so they could actually be worth less than 300 if they die a lot? And are assists worth any gold/xp or just kills?

So if another item also had an AoE damage that said unique it would stack with the Sunfire Cape but just not with more of itself? Cool.

Olaf tips (or even more general melee team fighting tips) still welcome!

5252

Every so often they do update these. I think it took like 2 or 3 patches after it was introduced for them to change boots to show that they build into the Ionian Boots. This is one of those things that they really should update more often but don’t. Seems like every 3 or so months they do a “update the store/update recommended items” pass.

Also I totally agree with you on the animations. DoW has sweet animations but I rarely appreciate them when playing. They do make watching replays more entertaining, and they make trailers more exciting!

5253

Glad to help :)

Sometimes people talk about whether a kill trade is worth it or not. How much are kills and assists worth in gold? Does the value of killing someone go up only if they’re on a kill streak or is it based on their total kills in the game so far? If three people kill another champion does only one person get an assist or do both of them?

A kill starts off being worth 300g (plus a 100g bonus for first blood). Each time somebody dies the amount of gold the give decreases by 70% (there is a minimum, iirc it’s 90g). This death penalty (or “feeder spree”) is reset when that person kills a champion. Just like the “killing spree” bonuses are lost when you die. If you are on a “killing spree”, which starts with a rampage after 3 consecutive kills and goes on up to godlike, you get bonus gold per kill (afaik, it’s the only bit I’m unsure on) and each rank of killing spree adds progressively more gold, to a total of 1000g at godlike, to a pot which will be awarded to the champion that kills you (in addition to the usual 300g).

The assist pool is completely separate from the kill gold. It’s always a set amount which is either divided evenly among everyone who got an assist or lost completely if the champion was killed without any assistance.

Is there a champion stat spreadsheet or sortable table on a web page somewhere? In particular I was wondering who has the longest and shortest ranged attacks or if they’re all the same but I wouldn’t mind comparing other stats.

Champ ranges are in a table here but that’s a bit out of date. As of yet there is no chart for a full comparison, a bit stupid I know but unfortunately people who know this stuff simply aren’t bothered.

Sometimes people say that certain items don’t stack bonuses. What are the rules about what does and doesn’t stack?

These are because there are a lot of items in the game right now with Unique properties. These items are usually unique because they provide some kind of team benefit/aura which would imbalance the game if it was possible to stack them. A list of them can be found here (although it doesn’t include Sunfire because that was a recent change).

It’s usually quite obvious which items have unique effects because it displays a big UNIQUE before the item effect in it’s description :)

What should I be doing in team fights as Olaf? I played a game with him yesterday that started out great, I think I was 4/0/5 by level 12 but then things went downhill when we started getting into the serious team fights. I had mostly been playing ranged guys until yesterday so when Olaf got all up in the shit it was hard to figure out what the heck was going on and then I was dead. I feel like I really let Olaf down and I make it one of my primary life goals to not upset people with nicknames like “The Berserker.”

Your job as Olaf is to hunt down those lovely ranged carries you used to play. I’m sure in your time playing them you’ve felt the terror of someone like Olaf barreling down on you.

Olaf’s whole design was focused on him being an anti-carry. You have your Ultimate which gives you immunity to all CC and can be cast WHILE CC’d. You become more powerful when you have lower health, and have a ridiculously high health pool to boot. You gain innate Lifesteal through your abilities allowing you to survive forever once you are hitting something and you have a skill that does a high amount of true damage.

When you get in a teamfight, you run straight at their squishiest/highest DPS character (usually the same person) and start shoving your axe in their face. If you begin to get CC’d then pop your ultimate and keep on hitting them. Anykind of slow (Frozen Mallet is core on him for a reason) helps this greatly as they will be unable to get away. Also don’t be afraid to pop Ghost in a big teamfight, melee characters need the extra mobility.

If you are really having a hard time following teamfights try holding Spacebar. It will keep the camera locked on your champion and can help you keep track of what’s going on.

-edit- Damn my slow typing… I started writing this aaages ago. I blame chatting with everyone on mumble :)

5254

Thanks, MK, lots of good tips to keep in mind. Looking forward to playing some tonight.

Also, here’s the free list someone pasted on the forum (since Riot hasn’t posted it yet):

Chogath
Gragas
Irelia
Kassadin
Soraka
Teemo
Mordekaiser
Veigar
Tristana
Ryze

Aw yeah. Incoming Irelia/Teemo/Mordekaiser in every game for a week, lolz. I think Gragas is the only one I haven’t unlocked yet but I’ve been wanting to try him out, so that’s cool. Good Teemos are amazing teammates, though. I don’t really like playing him but I’m glad when someone else does.

5255

Oh, so here is a question on Uniqueness:
If you build the crafted item, and then re-buy one of the lesser items, do those stack?

Like for example:
The katana thing (Ghost, lastwhisperer? can’t remember the name), and the brutalizer which is one of the mid level items used to make it, both reduce armor. If I rebuy the brutalizer after making the final item, do I get a bonus from it as well? Is it worth it for short run bursts? (I’m guessing most of the time, it’s not, but I’m curious about it, since Armor Pen gets really nasty if it gets high enough)

5256

Good Teemos are amazing teammates, though. I don’t really like playing him but I’m glad when someone else does.

finally someone appreciate my mushroomy fury!!!

oh… AD or AS or Hybrid teemo is DEAAAD

Long Live Pure AP Teemo… LLPAT!!

5257

Forgive me, I don’t fully recall brutalizer’s or Ghostblade’s stats. But armor pen stacks otherwise.

e.g. Brutalizer (is it +20 armor pen?) would stack with a Last Whisper (40%) and a Black Cleaver (15 per stack, up to 3 stacks, lasts 6 seconds I think).

Ghostblade gives armor pen on activation, right? I assume it would stack fine with brutalizer.

5258

Pretty sure ghost blade don’t stack with brutalizier just like sheen don’t stack with trinity or lichbane.

hmm apparently they do stack, ghostblade and brutalizer, but sheen don’t stack with lichbane though.

I guess normal stats stack but on proc don’t on certain items.

5259

Isn’t lichbane and sheen actually a different effect, one doubling AD and the other adding AP to your attack? Seems weird they wouldn’t. Sheen and Trinity are the same effect so that would make sense.

5260

Pure AP teemo is absolutely fucking shit.

Although still better then AD teemo :)