It’s truly daft to suggest that accusations of anti-semitism in the British Labour Party are all a conspiracy theory. If the British Labour Party can itself admit that it has a problem, I’m sure you can too.
In fact, it’s this kind of tribal attitude - these are my guys, they’re the good guys, they can’t be in the wrong - that leads to the adoption of anti-Semitic tropes in the British left. For that subset of the left for whom support of the Palestinians is a litmus test of ideological correctness, there has been a willingness to credulously believe anything - including all the old tropes of financial conspiracies and Holocaust denial - as long as it came from the mouths of people who were sound on Israel. (The Holocaust has always seemed a particular irritant to them. Viewing Israel as the unmitigated villain; Israel’s own claims to victimhood are very inconvenient. So some of these people can’t seem to stop themselves from buying into stories that minimise the Holocaust)
Nesrie
4170
I think one of the biggest problems with minority groups and the struggles associated with them is the constant disbelief and refusal to believe that horrible things happen and happen constantly. Since around 2018 though, we have cameras everywhere. So now it can’t as easily be brushed aside or disbelieved or claim well that’s just a rarity as often. I still don’t require video proof though. I think that’s should never be the bar.
I also realize that what left means or center right or certain political ideologies don’t directly transfer from one country to another so when someone says left it might not actually mean the same group. But we also live in a world right now where certain political groups are trying to rewrite history and claim fascism is a far left ideology instead of the far right it is… basically paint anything they don’t like as… left. This is just not okay, and it’s dangerous.
Do I believe there are people who have liberal ideologies or describe themselves as left at least who are anti-Semantic, absolutely. Even if I didn’t see Nazis on TV walking down the streets shouting that, I knew.
I completely agree with you about attempts to rewrite history, it’s frankly disgusting and ignores their own words about what they want to associate with. And you are right, what is “left” or “right” can depend a lot on the politics and culture of that country/area.
I think this is a great point (also brought up very well in the first paragraph) that not all of the evidence is going to be plastered on tv.
I don’t say all accusations are a conspiracy theory. I say the idea that there is some anti-semitism problem particular to the Labour Party or to the broader left is daft and that there was an obvious effort by the right to sell that idea. There is bigotry everywhere, and it isn’t surprising to find a bigot in any group. The objection is to the claim — or the implication — that it is there as a consequence of some intrinsic property or value of the left, rather than despite those values and properties.
Ok, this is stupid:
Who cares who a translator is? What you want is the translation to be faithful and done right. You are still reading the original author (if the translation is truthful).
I know why this specially bothers me. One of the bests translators of literature to Spanish was a woman that translated, among others, Ítalo Calvino. She translated the writings of somebody quite different to her beautifully and thoughtfully. I fondly remember reading her translator notes and being awed at her craft and aware of the subtleties of translation, and she was a reason I pushed myself to read everything written in English in its original language when I still struggled with long complex works.
This makes me think of Edith Grossman, the woman who translated most of the works of Garcia Marquez, along with many other writers in Spanish including, of course, Cervantes. I read recently that Garcia Marquez once said he preferred her English translations to his originals. That is what matters in translation — the ability to convey the writer’s intent faithfully despite the markedly different language, idioms, colloquialisms.
Definitely matters more than color of skin or gender. I will make the concession that maybe in a certain type of poetry translation (where the translator not so much translates as “rewrites” the original) a translator might need to take more from her personal experience, but I’ve always been very suspect of those kind of translations. They tend to modify the original too much and become different works.
Anyway, it’s backwards in many ways, because by criticizing the choice of a white translator and pushing for her removal, they are indeed silencing the original author who chose the translator herself.
Aceris
4176
And the ensuing bbc coverage lead to this tweet:
link is to a page that refers to jews as an ethnic group in the quote “Roma, Sikh, Jewish and Somali ethnic groups”
Rob Burl would never imagine using this page to claim that Roma, Sikh or Somali are not ethnic groupings, but he does so for jews.
magnet
4177
The full quote is that the government is considering adding those groups, which confirms that are not currently listed as ethnic groups.
Aceris
4178
No, they are considering adding these groups, which exist, to the list of groups that should be used when gathering standardised ethnicity data. That is very clear if you actually read the link.
It’s certianly not evidence that the government doesnt regard groups not listed as ethnic groups.
You’re not being provocative, you’re being an idiot.
Aceris
4180
But that Mitt Romney fellow was a fantastic check on Donald Trump. If Dems helped elect John Kasich to the senate that would be twice as effective! /s
magnet
4181
In England and Wales, there are 18 ethnic groups recommended for use by the government when asking for someone’s ethnicity. Jews are not among them.
There is little substantial difference between what I just wrote and that Tweet. And what I wrote is supported directly from the government website.
Aceris
4182
There is a huge substantial difference. You know it. You are being racist. Goodnight.
magnet
4183
No, the government is being racist.
And when someone points it out, you defend the government because the government is considering not being racist.
Kasich is perfectly welcome to join the Democratic party if he likes, and then try to run for office under that banner. He might even win, depending on how bad the other candidates are.
And then we would be listing Manchin, Sinema and Kasich all the time, instead of just Manchin and Sinema.
Aceris
4185
This is a really really good point. Kasich needs the Dems a hell of a lot more than the Dems need Kasich. Ohio has open primaries, if he can win the dem primary then that’s evidence he has a lot of popularity in Ohio and can reach out to dem voters as well. Otherwise, why the hell compromise the Dems long term chances at an Ohio senate seat for someone to the right of Manchin?
Unlike most posters here I’m quite a fan of Yglesias, but this was just an awful awful take.
That sort of tripe is why we have a fascist problem in the US. Dems need to stand for progress, not just the status quo. Status quo doesn’t cut it anymore. Most Dems do support progress, but folks like Manchin and Sinema make it look otherwise.
I laid it out for you. There is a section of the British left for whom objections to Israel are so important to their political identity that anti-semitism follows naturally.
Quick, hide before @Timex sees it!
