This complaint is mostly about representation. Minorities are under-represented on-screen as a % of total roles, so when there’s a role that specifically indicates a minority, casting a white actor in that role feels particularly aggressive. I.e. people are upset that historically, it hasn’t gone both ways, it’s only gone the direction of white actor in minority role.
Fine – I get that. But as an attitude towards the way it should be, we can’t only allow one direction and not the other. What is the alternative? Only allowing it in one direction until we’ve gauged the percentage of roles and we’re happy with it? Would the representation have to match the population breakdown of a particular country? Which one?
Just let anyone play any role. The only constraints should be where it logically doesn’t make sense, which should only be when portraying real stories in historical situations, or sci-fi stories trying to make a particular point relating to race.
Sure. If race is important to the character / story / setting, it matters. If it isn’t important to any of those, then in an ideal world, yes, the casting should be race-neutral (and gender-neutral, age-neutral, etc).
The contention is that we’re pretty far from neutral right now. There are very few cases of neutral roles that just happened to be played by people of color, because historically casting hasn’t been neutral, and minority roles tend to have been written specifically as minority characters.
Since we’re talking about Hollywood, the particular country would be the U.S. And that doesn’t sound like an unreasonable solution to me. Bias it the other way until we get close to population breakdown of the U.S, then switch to anyone play any role?
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I wonder how true that is now? I imagine that Disney is making decisions based on worldwide appeal, not just the US market.
I mean, you can do some elaborate segmentation if you want. It depends on the films. Big-budget action movies famously get bit world-wide releases, and so they’re going to tend to go a little more global-casting there (or do international edits that insert characters like the Iron Man 3 Chinese edits).
But many films are still primarily US-market targeted. Most comedies, or Serious Issue Dramas are pretty dependent on cultural elements, so those are going to be mostly US-market based. Even if they’re released internationally, they aren’t really being made with foreign markets as a prime consideration.
Saw my teeny niece wear the original Ariel on her shirt, and I just realized – this is now going to be a racist statement, isn’t it?
Umm, no. Unless you make it into one with a nice little Nazi slogan or something like that underneath.
Yeah Disney is not erasing previous versions. They’re just offering new versions for those who want them (a lot of people do).
I thought so as well, but looking at the white Ariel made me realize that any character that’s offered in a POC flavor presents a problem later on. If you happen to choose to show the white version, why did you do that? It feels like a deliberate choice. I get the same feeling already with the white version of Nick Fury in Marvel Ultimate Alliance. Aside from the fact that Jackson is awesome as Fury, it also feels wrong.
Eh, it isn’t a replacement representation, the stying is so different (live action vs 2d animation) that they serve different purposes.
They aren’t scrubbing O.G. Ariel out of existence, she’ll still be part of the Princess branding, etc, and she cartoons still work better on, e.g. a kids t shirt.
Fury is a little bit of a different situation, where I think SLJ Fury has mostly replaced O.G. Fury even in the primary conics universe, but those lines seem pretty blurry these days. Still, using the old version is probably seen more as a nostalgia play than a racist one.
It’s Disney, all their imagery is evergreen. Absent other racist context, nobody is going to care, because the old versions are well established.
I hear what you’re saying, but given the discomfort I already feel when looking at white Ariel, I wouldn’t be surprised if they retroactively change Ariel to be black. Sounds a little crazy, but I don’t think it’s as outlandish as it seems, given cultural sensitivities.
Are you projecting…onto yourself? It sounds like you’re caught in a feedback loop of being uncomfortable that other people might be uncomfortable since you’re uncomfortable.
I think the cartoon version will be just fine. I don’t doubt that somewhere on the internet someone will try to stir up some angst or fear about this just for the outrage traffic, but I don’t anticipate it’s something anyone will take seriously.
It is possible, even likely, that they will produce a cartoon version of the live action character for merchandising, similarly to how they have a stylized 2d version of Anna and Elsa for certain merch. The movie specific merch will certainly feature the new version.
It’s hard to say though, they haven’t really done that for other live action versions, but this is probably the biggest departure they’ve taken from the original design in a live action version, so there isn’t much precedent. The smart bet is that they just run two product lines side by side, because that’s where the most money is. Disney’s inclusivity is ultimately about selling the most product to the most people, so they aren’t going to close off any avenues without good reason.
Also, just so you know, this is veering pretty close to “you will not replace us” rhetoric. I genuinely don’t think you intend it that way (and I find questions of how Disney merchandises their Princess line fascinating, so I’m happy to discuss), but some people might, so it’s something to be careful of.
I have no ill will against the black version of Ariel, and I don’t mind her at all (as a complete aside, I don’t consider myself white, either). I don’t think it’s wrong to notice that the cultural currents currently tend to blow in one direction. I suggested up-thread that any actress of any race should be able to play any other race, and that’s still my opinion, despite the fact that a white actor/actress playing a non-white role would provoke a much bigger reaction on the Internet.
This is simply an analysis of a reaction I’ve found in myself, and a possibility I’m suggestiing going into the future. Like you say, we’re stepping into new ground here – the only pre-existing case I know for this is Nick Fury. I could easily imagine a future where white Ariel becomes symbolic of racism, whether it’s because it’s first iconized by racist white groups as a stupid rejection of the live version, or because people just feel a sense of discomfort with her – the same one everyone feels when they do/say something and are unsure if it could be seen as racist in some context they’re currently unaware of.
Honestly, I doubt the latter scenario because speculatively thinking about “would other people find this racist” probably puts you in the top 10% of woke-ness to begin with. Most people probably wouldn’t even consider it.
There have been a handful of examples from the Marvel side.
- Heimdall / Lady Thor: there’s some difficult pre-existing stuff with white supremacy and Norse mythology there, but mostly, nobody was wearing Heimdall or Thor merch, so they were kind of non-issues.
- New Spidermen: Racists made a little bit of noise about Miles Morales, but Spiderman merch is mostly about the costume / mask anyways, and there’s been enough variations on the costume that one more kind of doesn’t matter.
The film stars singer and actress Halle Bailey (“grown-ish”) as Ariel; Tony Award® winner Daveed Diggs (“Hamilton,” “Snowpiercer”) as the voice of Sebastian; Jacob Tremblay (“Luca,” “Room”) as the voice of Flounder; Awkwafina (“Raya and the Last Dragon”) as the voice of Scuttle; Jonah Hauer-King (“A Dog’s Way Home”) as Prince Eric; Art Malik (“Homeland”) as Sir Grimsby; Noma Dumezweni (“Mary Poppins Returns”) as Queen Selina; with Oscar® winner Javier Bardem (“No Country for Old Men,” “Being the Ricardos”) as King Triton; and two-time Academy Award® nominee Melissa McCarthy (“Can You Ever Forgive Me?” “Bridesmaids”) as Ursula.
