DT1
5801
According to the enhanced version of the Jacob/Smokey beach conversation, they mention the timeframe was over 140 years ago from present day. That would put it right at 1867. They also mention that it was an early 1800s sailing ship. It seems to suggest pretty strongly that it is the Black Rock.
However, I don’t think it’s that big of a deal how they showed it tonight. Heck, they had to find some way to knock the statue over!
Also, can we get a ruling on whether the Island is officially a MacGuffin, yet?
My memory is vague, but didn’t Jacob in last year’s scene make a mention of “someone on the ship?”
Wow. Nice apologies. That’s some strong Kool-Aid.
The ‘supporting cast’ of Nestor Carbonell, Michael Emerson, and Terry O’Quinn are amazing.
Two things.
First, were they still using ships with sails like that in the 1860’s? I thought they’d have steamships by then.
Also, why can’t they get a decent translator to review the script? The Spanish verb for hanging as a form of execution is “ahorcar,” not “colgar,” as any decent grad student of the language, or any nearby university Spanish prof could have told them.
Im spanish, and i say colgar.
For execution? Hmm, maybe it’s a Spain vs. Latin American thing–perhaps the term used to be “ahorcar” when the Conquista happened and that’s the word Spanish speakers in Latin America kept using. I know the proverb is “No hay que hablar de la soga en la casa del ahorcado.” aka “One shouldn’t bring up (the topic of) rope in the house of the hanged man.”
Also, I noticed his wife kept saying “cierra tus ojos” instead of “cierra los ojos”. It’s not common to use the possessive adjective “tus” in that situation, since it’s understood whom the eyes in question belong to.
They are both ok, it all depends from where the people saying that are, for example i would say, “cerra los ojos” instead of cierra.
its funny tho, i kept reading the english subtitles instead of just hearing what they said :|
Many ships were still sail-only at this time, though you had more than a few that were essentially hybrids, with sails and steam-powered screws, as well.
— Alan
HRose
5810
I’ve read enthusiast comments here, then watched the ep and came pretty much deluded.
Yes, I also noticed the inconsistency of the ship arriving with a storm instead of sunlight, but what annoys me is that I was waiting the whole episode to see something new, yet it was not delivered.
This episode adds absolutely nothing new. The only new aspect is that characters are now wondering about afterlife the same way we’re doing while trying to put the pieces together, but it’s all gratuitous speculation.
Actually there’s a part about Locke stealing Jacob’s body. What’s the point of this considering that we’ve never seen any precedent scene, not counting the beach?
P.S.
The forthcoming episodes have interesting titles:
Happily Ever After
What They Died For
corsair
5811
I had suspected for some time he came on the Black Rock, eventually confirmed obliquely by UnLocke saying he last saw Richard in chains (presumably aboard the Black Rock, noted as a slaver) and with dynamite being on the Black Rock, that pretty much meant 1867 was the earliest it could have been that he got to the island (and that’s allowing a lot, since they’d have to get an early shipment to the Canary Islands of all places, and then the ship make the long voyage to the Pacific).
On the subject of sailing ships, yes, they were still quite active in 1867. Steamships, while around, had not taken over all shipping yet.
HRose
5812
Also, isn’t it weird that Hanso doesn’t show up after the wreck?
He’s supposed to survive as well but the only guy who is shown is Richard.
Didnt one of the officers shout that Captain Hanso was dead?
dtolman
5814
Where is it said that the Black Rock visited only once? It seemed to me that they knew where they were going - why else carry dynamite and slaves who speak english - after the US civil war, when the slave market was gone?
For that matter, when was it said that only a single sailing ship ever visited the island?
The Hanso mentioned in this ep was some ancestor of Alvar Hanso, a name that means nothing to anyone who hasn’t followed the ARG stuff. I think it can be safely assumed that the Hanso Foundation won’t ever be brought into the show and those plot threads will be dealt with in some post-show non-televised canon.
That said, I think it of interest that the Black Rock is Hanso’s, and Widmore was seen a few seasons back being very interested in buying the log of the ship. From that and other scattered pieces of information, I think it is reasonable to conclude that Widmore himself is not allied with Hanso. I suspected this, of course, but the show hasn’t really made it clear until now.
If this is the case, it can be further assumed that Widmore and Mittelwerk are allies. Considering the cartoonish levels of evil that Mittelwerk is supposedly involved in, this makes Widmore’s totally-not-poker-faced struggle not to laugh when Sawyer said “you can kill him” mildly more chilling…
although, not really so much for me anymore, because if they can’t be bothered to keep track of when is daylight and when is dark from one season to the next, I can’t be bothered to maintain a feeling of interest in who wins and who loses.
Perhaps that was the point.
I’m killing you with my mind right now.
Or, you know, watched the previous seasons.
Okay, so lemme get this straight - you’re a big enough fanboy to follow the rather silly ARG and to reference a character here who never appeared on the show, but this plot inconsistency that’s not really an inconsistency at all has you ready to give up on the show.
Got it.
Jazar
5819
Maybe I’m overestimating his powers, but I got the impression that Jacob summoned a storm to bring in the ship.
The main point, however, should be that it wouldn’t matter anyway - they could have passed The Island during the day, gotten caught in the snowglobe because they weren’t pointed at 369.234 degrees and gone around in circles until the storm happened.
What bothers me is the timing. I would have figured 1600s for a Spanish slave ship - 18th century at the latest. 1864 is very nearly after the U.S. Civil War, and I thought that even at the time there weren’t that many nations still practicing slavery. I could easily be wrong about that, but I’m forced to wonder why they didn’t play safe and roll back fifty or a hundred years.
