Again, why is it acceptable to continue choking him after he stopped struggling?
It’s really impressive the lengths you’re going to - and have gone to since the initial incident reporting - to defend a guy who choked someone else to death.
Timex
4957
Just because he stopped struggling wouldn’t mean that he’s unconscious, so you wouldn’t necessarily want to release him. But again, we are taking about less than a minute.
Just now, on MSNBC, we have people saying that he was choked for 10 times the length of time necessary to cause him to lose consciousness. He’s lying, right? Or at least, he’s trying to create a false narrative, which was held by people here. That the guy choked him for a long time after he went unconscious. And that didn’t happen.
So this argument that we know the Marine intended for him to die, because he chuckled him for 15 minutes, or 5, or 4, after he was unconscious, is now, because he choked him for, at most, 50 seconds after he was unconscious.
Maybe those statements are the same to you. They seem very different to me.
At this point, is not even defending him. It’s just pointing out that people are judging him based on things which are false.
Are you really so certain this guy is a murderer?
What? Why would you need to wait until he was unconscious?
Timex
4959
You wouldn’t necessarily wait until he’s unconscious. You would ideally wait until the police showed up and took control of things.
I’m not sure I understand your thinking here. If you are in that situation, and you are restraining someone, as soon as they stop actively fighting you, you would release them? What do you imagine would happen after that?
But again, I’m not sure why you are even asking this, because the time between when he was actively fighting them, and being released, was 50 seconds.
Yeah, that’s a risk you take when you involve yourself in a situation like that.
Plus, the guy is outnumbered. You let him go, and if you need to restrain him again, you do it. In a less deadly manner.
And I don’t get why you seem to think that 50 seconds is some trivial amount of time in this situation.
Timex
4962
Yeah, I guess. To me, 50 seconds is a short amount of time.
I imagine that you might have a hard time making lots of important decisions, if only given 50 seconds. If I placed you into a situation like this? I suspect you would have even more trouble.
But maybe I’m wrong, and you would be able to quickly assess and act in that kind of situation, faster than that. I don’t know that I would be able to.
I’m going to say that 50 seconds is a very, very long time to be applying a potentially fatal chokehold on an unresponsive person. And if you can’t assess the situation that fast, you really shouldn’t be applying a potentially fatal chokehold to someone in the first place.
Timex
4964
Sure, man. Getting in this situation probably wasn’t the smartest thing this guy did in his life.
It doesn’t change the fact that I can imagine 50 seconds being a short amount of time to make that assessment for someone who perhaps was never in that situation before.
And again, as soon as he was told the guy was out, he let go immediately.
Tell you what, find a spot in your house where you have something punching-bag-like, and then hit it as hard as you can for as long as you can as fast as you can. If you last more than 15 seconds, I would be impressed. Restraining someone for 15 minutes, such as holding their hands behind their back, I get that, provided they presented a real threat and wouldn’t calm down. Putting someone in a full rear naked choke . . . well.
First point is, if you’re doing it right, they should be unconscious within 15 seconds, not 15 minutes. Second point is that if you have them in that hold, there should be a time about every 10 seconds when you try to de-escalate and ask if they’re willing to calm down and stop being aggressive. I’m not watching a snuff film, I guard my memory harder than that, so it could or could not have gone down that way.
Heck, just wrap some duct tape around your wrist as hard as you can and then wait 50 seconds. I will bet that you release it way before that. Pro tip: at your age you really need to consider blood clots from such a thing causing a DVT or an aneurysm.
