We can’t very well have previewers complaining about how dark the game is, now can we?

I still haven’t figured out what they’re talking about when they say stuff like that.

He’s saying that the style of interaction will be like Fallout - somebody asks you something, and you’re presented with a bunch of different responses - but the presentation will be like Oblivion, by which I assume he means it will zoom in on the talking head of whoever you’re talking to.

Seems easy enough to understand.

Have any of the previews compared the talking heads? The reactions on some of the FO1/2 dialogs were great. I particularly enjoyed upsetting Lynette in Vault City.

I was more complaining about how that similarity alone doesn’t justify the “dialogue is similar to Oblivion” line since that also implies topical discussion options and persuasion mini-games. Doesn’t just about every RPG have a dialogue mechanic that is presented exactly like that?

Sure, but he’s not doing PR for non-Bethesda companies.

I assume he means the presentation in Fallout and Oblivion were pretty similar, where the camera zooms in to the talking head, the player chooses an option, and then watches the NPC’s reply/animation.

But yeah, lol or something.

Hey, finding new screenshots and posting them is my gig. I like it becuase by default it makes my contribution of better quality than most of the thread :)

sorry sir, won’t happen again. I do dig that security bot. Hope we can hack them to be friendly.

Nah, Dark is in there. It’s Dark.

(I played for an hour on Friday. Will be some notes on it on RPS later)

KG

Gore gets a bit crazy sometimes:

World detail seems the most interesting stuff on the game:

The AI actually lets the NPCs to run and try to cover sometimes, other times sort of fails:

This thing reminds me a couple of people from this forum:

You’re going to fit in fine here. Welcome!

My secret shame as a “hardcore gamer” is that I’ve never played Fallout 1 or 2.

Go go Gadget-Good-Old-Games beta?

I will definitely be getting FO3, though.

Just do a quick tour of Fallout 1. That ought to cover you and provide a little perspective. Obviously, if you enjoy it, go for 2. But it’s not super long so it’s worth grabbing before FO3 is out.

Is night in FO3 at all comparable to night in STALKER?

No, I wasn’t thinking that, actually. But even going by your definition of RPGs, (a definition which seems bizarre, to say the least) MMOs do react to the players’ actions. When certain actions are fulfilled, zone wide (or even game wide) occurrences take place. These zone-wide or game-wide occurrences always seemed rather gimmicky & lame to me, but hey… the game world is reacting to the players’ actions.

BTW, a much better defintion of RPG is one in which story lines are uncovered & completed based directly on your actions. And MMOs meet that definition.

Well, for me a big part of RPGs is the endgame. The feeling of doing something epic. MMOs don’t really do that, except as you mention, in a gimicky way.

I always hated the feeling in MMOs of doing something totally epic and awesome, only to find out that you go back to a town everyone greets you the same still and nothing really has changed.

That and I’m a game “finisher” and MMOs don’t have a finish, which bothers my game finisher OCD a bit.

I think the disconnect we have here is how we both understand the game-world and what influencing it truly means. As I said when I gave my views on the MMOs I’ve played (EVE isn’t one of them, which seems to buck the trend in more ways than three), there are dodges and caveats of the stasis of the game world. I assume you’re talking about such things as placing dragon heads in SW.

That pretty much amounts to dunking the hoboclown. You get a neat little prize, the guy goes back to drinking turpentine while he straddles the 2x4, that’s it. In other RPGs, such as… any of them, such an event would only happen once per play-through, not once per week, and the world as a whole would be change in a non-insignificant way. Certainly, it would be far more than, say, an hour-long buff.

You could’ve said, “Tankero, you are as foolish as you are handsome; rep-grinds change how the world reacts to the player in WoW!” Fine, ya got me, that is a good example of an element that disproves my statement. Aside from the fact that you didn’t think of that yourself, you’ve completely undone my argument…

Except that the way rep-grinds work, it means that there’s only two ways to meaningfully influence the world; you spend gold buying stuff to turn in, or you kill crap that gradually fills a bar. There is no other meaningful way to interact with the world, and one of the staples of the RPG genre is the ability to talk your way through at least ONE situation. Given the fact that, aside from combat, MMO player-characters are completely passive entities (even with AoCs dialogue system), that possibility just doesn’t exist.

The fact, [b]fact[/b] that player-characters in MMOs are completely passive, it means that they’re essentially spectators, readers, the audience of an MMO’s world as it goes on its merry way, which means that…

…is completely false. You don’t do anything that advances the storyline, you just ‘flip the page’, ‘turn the crank’, and any other such aphorism. You never guide the story, the story is already there. You could argue that this is also true in so many other games that there’s no point in bringing that up. There, once more, I’d have to yield, except that in MMOs there is no storyline, by definition, because there is no end. You get to witness plenty of storylines, sure, but you’re never directly involved in any of them. All you’re doing is triggering the next text-box you’re not going to read anyway.

Kieron preview is up.

You mean the way that most single player RPG’s act before the end of the game? Like in Fallout 1 where I killed Gizmo in Junktown but everyone kept referring to Gizmo and his place?

The only real difference is that you get some closure at the end. Since MMO’s don’t have an end, you don’t get that.

I just think that there are lots of people, like me, that prefer our RPG’s single player. Our options are limited as it is, and I don’t really want the devs to spend time hacking in a co-op mode for the people that have tons of other ways to experience that aspect of gaming.

Yes, I get that. Although some of the epic-level quest-lines in WoW would have a continuation back at the home city (Stormwind in the Onyxia quest chain) that would have a procession, city-wide broadcast dialog from some NPCs during the scripted sequences, and then a city-wide free buff for everyone and fireworks. But it still doesn’t have that “final” feeling…