New Mechwarrior game coming?

Timex · 2013-01-25T23:04:01.000Z

TheWombat:

HBK-4G
1xGauss Rifle
2xML
1xAMS
Standard HS
Endo

Swap the Gauss for an AC20, add in another medium laser, put on Double Heat sinks, and you have one of my favorite mechs in the game. The AC20 hunch is an absolute beast in a skilled pilot’s hands.

HBK-4P
2xLL
2xML
1xAMS
Double HS

Drop the LL’s and put on a bunch more medium lasers. Running 7 is a good number.

ALso, I’d recommend going with a Standard 250 as the engine.

HBK-4J
2xML
1xLPL
1xSRM6
Endo

Two things here…

Never use pulse lasers. Seriously. Never. Especially Large pulse lasers, which are easily one of the worst weapons in the entire game… They are basically like medium lasers which weigh a huge amount, and run stupid hot.
Use the missile slots, and run two SRM6’s, which are some of the best weapons in the game.

Janster · 2013-01-26T04:25:06.000Z

Agree, Pulse stuff is for Atlas and other large mechs who want them as anti-light mech weapons. I have tried to use Large Pulse, and they just haven’t got any uses on the battlefield…

AC 20 is a MUCH better choice for just about anything, except ranged fighting, but you don’t want that in a Hunch imho.

The 20 does more damage, scares people, and causes urine stained seats.

Its a VERY good heatshot weapon.

pg1 · 2013-01-28T15:30:10.000Z

JoshV:

My opinion is that a game should be able to stand on its own without having to go to an external website to learn how to play or to organize a group. And in that sense MWO is the biggest failure I’ve ever seen.

I sort of agree with this. I wish they’d put the “good” builds as trials. Why? It’d force balance more so and given people options (even non-newbie players). This is a guess but there’s probably something like 100 viable builds but most of them are focused on a few specific mech variants.

I agree they can improve but public games just tend to suck in all FPS. Just by making the choice to use a voice server says a lot about you as a player. The biggest advantage is that in a group you’re way less likely to have a player go AFK, disconnect or suicide charge the enemy. I’ve played with some real bad skilled guys but just knowing they won’t do anything like that is a big plus since being up a mech or two almost always leads to victory.

The minimap isn’t that great but given how the maps play out you don’t need it really either. I barely use it and see it more as a tool to help newer players get familiar with the terrain. Each side seems to have one default defensive move or two attacking options on every map. For instance on lower spawn on River City the best default defensive opening is move over to the water and put a few LRM/sniper mechs up on the middle city over looking the river. Then once you figure out what the other team is doing you can either wait for them or react. The upper spawn on River City the default defensive position is just to wait at your base. The two attacking routes for both spawns are going to upper city or lower city, or if you are feeling ballsy go down the river (only a good idea in specific situations, quite risky). Most of the other maps play out very similarly with one close defensive position and attacking around the flanks.

One thing they need is the ability to see your team mates load outs (via Q). It’s ridiculous you can’t see your own team’s weapons but you can see what the enemy is using.

With the improved netcode I’m actually sort of fearing MWO might venture into becoming a sniper heavy game (especially in competitive play). Builds like 4xPPC or 2xGauss/1xPPC can easily head shot anything from very far away. Sure they have big disadvantages but great aim seems to trump any major down sides.

TheWombat: OK I understand you now and respect where you are coming from. You just aren’t into MWO at the moment. I’m fairly passionate about it because I see it as a potential game I could enjoy for years but it has a ways to go yet. I’m actually much more interested in the competitive side of things (spectating, demos, private/customer servers, etc) than community warfare.

maxle · 2013-01-28T15:51:47.000Z

JoshV:

My opinion is that a game should be able to stand on its own without having to go to an external website to learn how to play or to organize a group. And in that sense MWO is the biggest failure I’ve ever seen.

I take it you were never an MMO player? Imagine trying to learn to tank in WoW without reference to any external sources or even friends (at the same time you’re trying to learn how to play an MMO).

Not that I disagree with your point!

McKnight · 2013-01-28T17:14:54.000Z

maxle:

I take it you were never an MMO player? Imagine trying to learn to tank in WoW without reference to any external sources or even friends (at the same time you’re trying to learn how to play an MMO).

Not that I disagree with your point!

I did, it was extremely fucking easy and straightforward to be honest. At least when I started playing the game, not that is has any bearing on this discussion though :)

JoshV · 2013-01-28T17:33:52.000Z

pg:

I sort of agree with this. I wish they’d put the “good” builds as trials. Why? It’d force balance more so and given people options (even non-newbie players). This is a guess but there’s probably something like 100 viable builds but most of them are focused on a few specific mech variants.

I agree they can improve but public games just tend to suck in all FPS. Just by making the choice to use a voice server says a lot about you as a player. The biggest advantage is that in a group you’re way less likely to have a player go AFK, disconnect or suicide charge the enemy. I’ve played with some real bad skilled guys but just knowing they won’t do anything like that is a big plus since being up a mech or two almost always leads to victory.

The minimap isn’t that great but given how the maps play out you don’t need it really either. I barely use it and see it more as a tool to help newer players get familiar with the terrain. Each side seems to have one default defensive move or two attacking options on every map. For instance on lower spawn on River City the best default defensive opening is move over to the water and put a few LRM/sniper mechs up on the middle city over looking the river. Then once you figure out what the other team is doing you can either wait for them or react. The upper spawn on River City the default defensive position is just to wait at your base. The two attacking routes for both spawns are going to upper city or lower city, or if you are feeling ballsy go down the river (only a good idea in specific situations, quite risky). Most of the other maps play out very similarly with one close defensive position and attacking around the flanks.

One thing they need is the ability to see your team mates load outs (via Q). It’s ridiculous you can’t see your own team’s weapons but you can see what the enemy is using.

Yeah, the minimap should, at a minimum, show Heavy/Light/Assault/Medium, and friendly ECM (showing the radius would be great too).

A screen that showed all the team’s loadouts would be great, and letting the player look at that screen before the match starts would be ideal. I hate how it freezes you on start, at least let the player muck with weapon groupings.

And I agree, it would be nice to just have the trial mechs be configs from the public. Just take the lightest mech with most wins from the previous week, make it the trial light mech, etc. I’d guess that it would even autocycle, because players would build counters for the trial mechs.

I don’t know if there are really 100 builds that are optimal, it feels like some variants are basically jokes that should not be bought, and some mechs that are just suboptimal in general. Much less if you count for noise (ie a mech that has four PPCs but a small laser is pretty much the same as a mech that has just four PPCs and an extra heatsink)

pg1 · 2013-01-28T20:32:03.000Z

JoshV:

I’d guess that it would even autocycle, because players would build counters for the trial mechs.

Yeah, it’d probably work out well if only because people behind the curve so to speak aren’t probably the top players anyways.

JoshV:

I don’t know if there are really 100 builds that are optimal, it feels like some variants are basically jokes that should not be bought, and some mechs that are just suboptimal in general. Much less if you count for noise (ie a mech that has four PPCs but a small laser is pretty much the same as a mech that has just four PPCs and an extra heatsink)

I agree some variants just suck or have no purpose because another variant does everything they do and more. I guess it depends what you consider a build or not. There are lots of variations that are close but quite different. Example, two quick K2 builds -

http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab#i=19&l=c21b88173e6f66d14abbec6499d80235d8bd4800
http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab#i=19&l=a3c7f08f93b59ab940030d0bb8302213f0ffb2bd

One is a fast medium range direct fire support and the other is a brawler that has decent anti-light weapons. The change of standard<->XL engine and LBX10<->UAC5 results in much different tactical play.

pg1 · 2013-01-29T13:35:52.000Z

http://mwomercs.com/forums/topic/73536-weapon-balancing/page__view__findpost__p__1812228

These new PPC / ECM changes are odd. I’m not sure I like the idea of a PPC disabling ECM for 5 seconds. I thought they were going to make ECM more along the lines of table top.

Dreamshadow · 2013-01-29T13:41:00.000Z

pg:

http://mwomercs.com/forums/topic/73536-weapon-balancing/page__view__findpost__p__1812228

These new PPC / ECM changes are odd. I’m not sure I like the idea of a PPC disabling ECM for 5 seconds. I thought they were going to make ECM more along the lines of table top.

To be honest, I"m not. IN all the previous Mechwarrior games, a PPC hitting you was accompianied by a static sound and your displays flickering. I like this change. :)

pg1 · 2013-01-29T13:49:33.000Z

It sounds like it will just disable ECM for 5 seconds that’s all. There’s no mention of anything else.

Lazy_Shiftless_Basta · 2013-01-29T14:55:24.000Z

pg:

I agree some variants just suck or have no purpose because another variant does everything they do and more.

Hey, you’re stealing my bit!

With regards to sniping becoming a main feature if they fix the netcode, that’s kind of a consequence of the design decision to not have any weapon deviation as far as I can remember. However that would only become a problem if they managed to fix the laggy mess that is their current netcode or you live next door to the physical servers.

Fishbreath · 2013-01-30T05:27:07.000Z

pg:

It sounds like it will just disable ECM for 5 seconds that’s all. There’s no mention of anything else.

It would make my PPC Jenner less of a curiosity and more of an actual useful mech (although I do better with the PPC/2xMLAS setup than I do with 4xMLAS)!

pg1 · 2013-01-30T09:53:14.000Z

The other thing I don’t like about the changes is they continue making modules actually matter somewhat (overtime it seems to be growing). GXP is very slow to get unless you pay to exchange it and modules are very expensive. If modules end up powerful MWO is going down a P2W path since the length of time to acquire them naturally, even with a premium account, is very long (months). Right now it’s ~60,000 GXP and ~30 million CBills to get all the modules. I have 27,500 GXP with ~900 matches played (started around open beta). I will admit exchanging XP->GXP isn’t terribly expensive as it’d cost 1200 MC (about $4) for me to get 30,000 GXP right now.

Here is a good example video why I’m fearful MWO will end up sniper heavy -
http://youtu.be/ZRIX4lO_1I8 - 4xPPC, 2xERPPC STK-5S

Soapyfrog · 2013-01-30T15:02:18.000Z

I have almost 2000 matches played, all modules researched and 15,000 gxp still to spend. I am averaging 35 gxp per match which means I have earned almost 70k.

Does not seem too unreasonable to me. Honestly the cbill cost as been a bigger barrier to me buying modules than gxp.

Eventually the target decay and sensor range modules (and probably 360 targeting) will become standard on my favourite mechs but for now I use none of them and do not feel notably disadvantaged.

In short, no where near pay to win.

JoshV · 2013-01-30T15:41:12.000Z

It wouldn’t matter if they had any form of matchmaking…

Janster · 2013-01-30T18:38:37.000Z

On the sniper heavy stuff.

I’d like to say that not all mechs are prone to it, and if you PPC up too hard, once you are in a brawl, you have no real dps to counter and misses will cost you…

In a good team, with teammates who can cover your boating ass, maybe it has a place, but you might just be better off with LRM’s, in the video, he only does about 250 damage, that’s not a whole lot…of the kills only 1 was a clean, rest was shooting damaged cores.

Fishbreath · 2013-01-31T07:18:41.000Z

To cite examples from my mech bay, PPC Jenner tops leaderboards much less often than MPLAS Jenner (which has had the same number of three-kill games in about half as many total games). PPCs are a huge pain to use in close combat, as are Gauss rifles, and the heat/damage tradeoff is much better on brawling weapons, it seems to me.

pg1 · 2013-01-31T09:38:41.000Z

Well the thing with snipers is you don’t want a full team of them. You also don’t want them on lights or mediums. Yet in a 8v8 with say 2 heavy CTF-3D snipers with jump jets could do a disproportionate amount of damage and kills compared to the rest of the team. I’ve already seen 8v8s matches where this happens, they are called “poptarts” because they jump jet up over a hill take a high alpha shot then drop back down. With the rest of the team protecting them it works to their advantage in a major way. I’m sure most of you know once you get up a mech or two the game is virtually won. With a head shot or two at the start of the match from long distances snipers could be the most important part of any team. Personally I’m sick of snipers dominating so many FPS games where the whole game revolves around protecting them and I’d absolutely hate to see MWO end up down that path in competitive 8v8 matches. Timex probably plays 8s more than me, I wonder if he has seen this a lot in MWO.

JoshV · 2013-01-31T12:00:34.000Z

They could fix that by adding some wobble when jump jetting. It should be stupid hard to get an accurate shot off while jump jetting.

Lazy_Shiftless_Basta · 2013-01-31T14:01:09.000Z

Yeah, that’s yet another area where they could improve the game by just looking at World of Tanks. Add even minor gun dispersion when moving and you get rid of stuff like pop up sniping.