NWN2 - Storm of Zephir

I found the beginning of MOTB so random and so difficult that it absolutely killed my enjoyment for the game. I had a monk that I imported over and he got beaten to a pulp the first 1-2 hours of MOTB. I had a warrior I imported over and he got beaten into a bigger pulp in the first couple hours. Eventually I gave up in frustration, even though the story seemed interesting and the writing was excellent.

Curious to hear how this one pans out; I love the old school party based games and would love to give this a shot.

I just reinstalled NWN2 in preparation for SoZ (hurry up D2D download!). Does SoZ update the game to the latest patch, or do I need to start the unbelievably slow in-game auto updater, before installing SoZ?

Install SoZ and then patch is what the devs are recommending.

Understood. Thanks.

I was surprised by that fight too.
I think you simply started it too early in the game.
You spend quite some time in the city and several optional fights can be triggered from the beginning, but are probably designed for a later stage.
There also is some minor non-linearity with the quest chains and if you do it the “wrong” way and chose (without knowing) the harder sub-quests first the difficulty curse is somewhat skimped.

Try attacking the badger… :P

You have to laugh (and cry?) a bit that it actually beat the adventure pack to market.

Thanks for the tips. It was a while back, but I believed I tried to multi a sorcerer to become a red dragon disciple. It sounded interesting in the guide, but my D&D experience is limited to PC games, and I still just assume it’s magic that’s tallying my dice rolls, so I was a bit over my head. The endgame of the original campaign was such a huge pain - about 90% of the way through my party would stop moving once I entered an area, including the final boss fight - that I put about an hour into MotB before quitting. I might as well start fresh. RIP Sir Ryan.

I suppose there’s no chance that the franchise will convert over to 4th Ed…

The franchise? Very good chance. NWN2 Expansions specifically? Not so much.

Perordered, should be picking it up today. Don’t let me down Obsidian! :)

I’ll wait for a combo pack to show up in stores.

I keep reading this thread title as “Storm of the Tapir” :/

I’m so glad I’m not the only one.

So what kind of parties are you folks planning? I won’t be able to pick it up for a couple of weeks since I’ve got forty bucks to my name at the moment, but I’m excited enough that I’ll be picking it up eventually.

I’ve played a wizard for the last two, so I’m kind of tired of that. And I’d like to complete this game with a completely different style of party than the last ones.

I’m leaning towards playing a warlock myself, with a druid as the healer archetype, a barbarian as the front line muscle man, and a rogue for stealing stuff and critical hits. My overall goal is a party with lots of skills, with a focus on doing lots of damage at the expense of armor.

I figure the “nerf” to rest means that the warlock ability to use spells ad nauseum will come in mad handy. And the focus on single target damage means I’ll be able to kill things faster than a wizard who doesn’t have disintegrate.

A druid makes sense to me because they can turn into a bear for more armor and health while still casting if they get that one feat, which should reduce my reliance on gear. Besides, I feel like clerics don’t hit hard enough and don’t have enough utility spells and skills to be worth losing a character slot. I’d be giving up a useful class mechanic (bear mode) for a useless one (turn undead) without gaining anything in the healing department.

Barbarians seem to have less reliance on armor and more on whatever weapon they have, but I’ve never used one before. How well do they survive being smacked around? Would a monk be a better pick?

I’m unsure about whether a rogue or a ranger would be a better pick for the last spot. I want a class that has a lot of skill points to use, wears decent armor, and doesn’t need to be in the front line to kill stuff – but can move into the front should things get hairy. Is a rogue with a bow effective? And if I choose to go with a bow, should I multiclass the rogue for a couple levels of warrior to get some weapon focus things? And, more importantly, is there another class that can fulfill this role better than either of these two classes?

I don’t have much experience with dnd, so I dunno how effective this party will be. But I did complete both campaigns on XXXTREEEMEE mode, so I figure I can muddle through somehow.

Elf Ranger. All the good survival-type skills: hide, move silently, survival, search, spot, listen, heal. Can be craftier with a sun elf (+2 DEX -2 CON), or beastlier with a wild elf (+2 STR/DEX, -2 CON/CHA). With this party I like the wild elf better since this character is the closest thing I have to a pure fighter.

Gnome Rogue 1/Bard X. Rogue stuff, plus doesn’t suck in combat! Able Learner feat is madly overpowered in this implementation, so he gets full ranks in open lock, disable device, and all the conversational stuff and lore.

Human Cleric/prestige to Doomguide. Clerics are unbelievable, and Doomguide loses you nothing from Cleric progression while granting some neat abilities. Sun/War domains. Frontline type of guy; most spells are used as emergency heals or self-buffs; bard and wizard got the support thing nailed.

Human Wizard/prestige to Arcane Scholar. Wizards are amazing, and Arcane Scholars get the ridiculous metamagic bonuses while only losing you two Wizard bonus feats. Yeah, I can handle that. This guy also does all the crafting.

This party kicks ass. Also – INCREDIBLY MINOR SPOILERS AHEAD – you meet two NPCs available for hire almost immediately. One’s a druid, the other’s a ranger. This may affect how you create your party.

One more thing! Only one permanent companion (familiar, animal companion) and one temporary companion (summon spells generally) can be out at a time. Don’t give your ranger Natural Bond if you already have a druid or an animal domain cleric.

Ooh fun, comments on other folks’ parties!

Yes, for damage warlocks are great. I personally don’t like playing a brute force style at all in D&D, so it’s not my thing. They’re definitely powerful, though.

A druid makes sense to me because they can turn into a bear for more armor and health while still casting if they get that one feat, which should reduce my reliance on gear.

Bleh. Bear AC is roflawful. My experience has druids better off with a shield and some decent armor rather than shifting. It’s neat as a crappy emergency heal I guess. In my experience druid shifting is pretty useless until the elemental shifts, and even those are situational.

Besides, I feel like clerics don’t hit hard enough and don’t have enough utility spells and skills to be worth losing a character slot. I’d be giving up a useful class mechanic (bear mode) for a useless one (turn undead) without gaining anything in the healing department.

Wha, wha, wha? Really? Clerics are silly. Also, I couldn’t disagree more on the merits of turning and shifting…a cleric with good CHA and maybe a feat or two utterly trivializes any undead encounter, which there are plenty of. Plus being able to spontaneously cast heals is awesome, though certainly druids’ ability to spontaneously cast summons has its own draws.

By the by, I’m not trying to hate on druids here. I really like the class; animal companions are great and they have more “fun” spells than clerics do. You’re not gimping yourself with a druid by any means. Plus, better skills.

Barbarians seem to have less reliance on armor and more on whatever weapon they have, but I’ve never used one before. How well do they survive being smacked around? Would a monk be a better pick?

Barbarians are all right. More damage (usually) than a fighter, some neat skill stuff along the lines of what rangers get, crappier defense and less combat utility than a fighter due to the lack of bonus feats. They do beat the absolute piss out of any type of rogue, though, due to not taking sneak attacks. Monks I personally despise in D&D, so I can’t give any useful commentary on that.

I’m unsure about whether a rogue or a ranger would be a better pick for the last spot. I want a class that has a lot of skill points to use, wears decent armor, and doesn’t need to be in the front line to kill stuff – but can move into the front should things get hairy. Is a rogue with a bow effective? And if I choose to go with a bow, should I multiclass the rogue for a couple levels of warrior to get some weapon focus things? And, more importantly, is there another class that can fulfill this role better than either of these two classes?

Here’s the thing. You need someone with rogue levels to disarm traps and open locks past a certain point (DC 25 I think? It’s fairly low). Think Tranq Shot in Molten Core. However, it’s perfectly feasible to multi Rogue with just about anything with the Able Learner feat (which in this implementation makes every skill that’s a class skill for any of your classes a class skill whenever you level up). I picked Bard, because bards are awesome. I’d suggest it for your party as well given its makeup – some of those arcane support spells will come in really handy with a warlock rather than wizard/sorcerer as your blammo caster.

Personally I think ranged combat in NWN blows total butts, so I avoid it at all costs. Damage sucks, mobs peel off and attack ranged dudes constantly, and it’s yet more micromanagement. Bleh. Both rogues and rangers can be good to excellent melee combatants if used properly, though.

What is a Tranq shot on Molten Core?

I agree that bear mode is only a halfway decent bonus, but I’m not sure what kind of gear I’ll find out there. And I definitely prefer the bear bonus to a situationally useful ability that puts further strain on the cleric’s already limited pool of free attributes and feats. Bear mode takes one feat to allow casting, and that’s it. Turn undead takes high CHA and a couple of feats to make it useful for something other than killing level 1 zombies.

Bottom line, Turn Undead is too expensive to be worth having.

I dislike the spontaneous spells mechanic, and I’ve never really had a situation where I’ve needed it in the previous games (even on very hard). A bit of prep work prevents it from coming up.

And as a final refutation of the cleric, Barkskin. Game, set, match, cleric loses. Barkskin was good in the original campaign until you started getting pimp gear. This game lacks the pimp gear, ergo Barkskin will be even more awesome. Clerics just don’t have anything near that level of great.

I disagree completely about the viability of ranged combat, but that might be because we’re both playing in completely different ways. I tend to prep the field by using some spells to disrupt enemies, and then use a KD skill if they decide to come after a ranged class. I figure a barb will be better for this type of gameplay because he’s less likely to go down under an aoe crowd control skill (reflex save!), but a monk might be an even better choice because of that skill that lets them dodge just about everything. Evasion or something.

Keeping the rest of the party in the back saves on healing and allows me to skimp on their armor in favor of the front line character. Since most of the damage is coming in the form of flank crits and rogues can flank crit from bows, it ends up working out really well. Much less micro than constantly moving the rogue behind targets.

Right now, I picked a human wizard specializing in Necromancy spells to lead the party. Then, I wanted to try the new classes, so I went with a Yuan-ti Ranger and a Grey Orc Cleric. I think I need a heavy bruiser to finish the party off, so a Earth gensei fighter is probable.

Why do you hate monks in D&D Adam? I liked them in BG2 + TOB but so far have not enjoyed their implementation in NWN2.

Still not sure if I am picking this up-any early word on the difficulty? I am still burned from MOTB.

Human bard / swashbuckler - team leader (high CHA + social skills), fencer (Weapon Finesse + Improved Parry), beaucoup skills (inc. crafting), lite buffer / spellcaster

Wood elf rogue / ranger - thieving and woodland skills, general asskicker

Aasimar cleric / Doomguide - party tank, healer / buffer, and undead smasher rolled into one

Halfling warlock / hellfire warlock - fire spammer

I figure the “nerf” to rest means that the warlock ability to use spells ad nauseum will come in mad handy.

That’s my thinking as well.

A druid makes sense to me because they can turn into a bear for more armor and health while still casting if they get that one feat, which should reduce my reliance on gear.

Pure clerics are better than pure druids, IMHO: heavy armor, more weapon proficiencies, and spontaneous-cast healing > spontaneous-cast summoning; plus shape-shifting isn’t all that great, especially once you have some decent gear. OTOH, multi-class a druid with a class which adds martial weapons and heavy armor (e.g., fighter, Warpriest) and now you’re onto something.

I’d be giving up a useful class mechanic (bear mode) for a useless one (turn undead) without gaining anything in the healing department.

FWIW, I suspect there will be a fair bit of undead in SoZ: why add doomguides otherwise? And you can pick up the divine feats which let you use a Turn Undead attempt for a short-term buff instead.

Barbarians seem to have less reliance on armor and more on whatever weapon they have, but I’ve never used one before. How well do they survive being smacked around?

Pros of barbarians over other warriors are higher HPs, Rage is a useful low-level buff, faster movement (+10%), can’t be flanked after level 5 (so no sneak attacks on them), and free damage reduction at level 7; cons include no heavy armor, Rage is less useful once you have other buffs available, and no bonus feats or spellcasting. They’re a good choice if you want someone who runs up and hits things as hard as he can. A barbarian / frenzied berserker with 2H weapons plus Power Attack is pretty nuts.

Would a monk be a better pick?

Low-level monks suck, IMHO; they start to get useful around level 6, when they gain Improved Knockdown.

I’m unsure about whether a rogue or a ranger would be a better pick for the last spot.

As you can see, I plan to do both (and pick up Able Learner). The main incentive to going with a pure rogue instead is if you want to focus on sneak attacks.

Between the ranger and the cleric you should be OK as long as you do a dual-wield build for the ranger and choose decent domains for your cleric. I would personally take a Favored Soul or a Bard over a regular ho-hum fighter.