Outliers

This is a really interesting book. I have no unique insights to contribute in a review; read anything on the internet. Try the David Leonhardt NYT review (gamers/gamers user/pass).

However, I do think I can elaborate on Yglesias’s theory about why it’s getting worse reviews than his previous work. Namely:

At the end of the day, it’s hard for me not to reach the conclusion that the backlash is, not coincidentally, coming just as Gladwell’s hit upon a politically charged topic and reached conclusions that are discomfiting to the very successful. I’ve seen a few people express the notion that Gladwell’s conclusion — that success is determined largely by luck rather than one’s powers of awesomeness — is somehow too banal to waste one’s time with. I think those people need to open their eyes and pay a bit more attention to the society we’re living in. It’s a society that not only seems to believe that the successful are entitled to unlimited monetary rewards for their trouble, but massive and wide-ranging deference.

Beyond that, it’s a society in which the old-fashioned concept of noblesse oblige has largely gone out the window. The elite feel not only a sense of entitlement, but also a unique sense of arrogance that only an elite that firmly believes itself to be a meritocracy can muster. Gladwell not only shows that this is wrong, but he does an excellent job of showing why it feels right. He explains that success does, in fact, require hard work — lots of it — and that people who think they got where they are through effort rather than good fortune are at least half right. The issue is that in some ways the best luck of all is the luck to be in a position to do hard work at a time when it pays off. Bill Gates, Gladwell explains, put in vast hours programming computers at a very young age at a time when almost nobody in the United States even had the opportunity to put in that kind of time in front of a computer screen.

As far as pop science books go, it’s a body blow to the American conception of how successful people got where they are. You can work hard all you want, and be smart all you want, but unless you’re lucky enough to have the opportunity (family income, social class, lack of bad luck) and do it at the right time (it’s not a coincidence that all the super-rich tech moguls were born in a 5-year period that made them the right age to capitalize on first-tech use of computers; it’s not a coincidence the all-time richest people list is crammed with Americans born in a certain 19th century 10-year period that made them the right age to capitalize on first-time industrialization), you’re not going to win. To boot, the smartest don’t win either - beyond a certain point, 130 or so, call it “smart enough to do well in a college”, IQ has no measurable relationship with success. At that point all the other factors take over.

Amusingly, the most convincing bit of evidence in the entire book is how strongly hockey success in the from-elementary-school system of Canadian hockey prep is correlated with birthdate. No, really - the kids born the closest to the cutoff for getting into an age bracket completely dominate the top players list at every level. You wouldn’t think that since they start off somewhat bigger than the other players would have such long-run effects, but does a great job of explaining on how that relative size difference makes them “better” at the beginning, so they get more accolades and specialized training, so they keep getting better, and it snowballs to the effect that people born in the second half of the year might as well not take up hockey in Canada. That hockey is a specialized sport requiring lots of equipment and exotic playtime feeds into this - the effect doesn’t exist as strongly for sports where anyone can just go play a pick-up game.

That book was a real eye opener for me. I also liked how he touched on true mastery of something requires somewhere around 10,000 hours of practice.

I’m going through the book myself. So far, the argument seems to boil down to nurture rather than nature. Sure you might be born with a certain set of talents that might help in you in future successes, but your overall future is determined by the external factors you find yourself in. Also the date thing intrigued me. So when I was reading a book on successful comic book writers, I noticed that they were mostly born in the years 1960s, which makes them uniquely suited to be mid-30s when the comic boom took off in the 90s post Claremont. It also makes a lot of sense explaining the frat pack of directors back in the 70s.

I am Malcolm Gladwell, please buy my new book Do: Why Some People Do Some Things and Other People Do Other Things.

Equis, it doesn’t seem like “nurture” covers it, as that doesn’t cover the structural factors that you find yourself in. You can learn all manner of good techniques or whatever, and still be held back by structural factors that make you achieve much less than the person in the right place at the right time (born rich or other random factor).
In fact, I’d say the nature vs. nurture framework is thoroughly lacking overall, as it removes far too many facets of our life histories.

I haven’t read the book, however.

Also, Marx was right!

Gladwell seems to be hinting that environmental factors, or external if you will, play a much larger role in the creation of success than inherent talent. I’m using nurture in the sense that the structural factors you find yourself in can usually “nurture” those qualities that will lead to success, whereas no given amount of natural talent will lead to the same thing if you’re lacking those external factors.

Nurture probably isn’t the best word to use then. More like finding yourself in fertile ground.

I see what you mean, I think my main annoyance is actually mostly with the media and how they frame these issues, being stuck with those terms.

Nurture probably isn’t the best word to use then. More like finding yourself in fertile ground.

Yes, and that timing and luck play as much a part in someone’s success as talent does.

This is just economic “the fastest with the mostest”; ie, when a new industry emerges, those with the peculiar skillsets to succeed in it, do.

So, you take that and extrapolate it out forever and (omg), only those poised to strike when the iron is hot do best! And therefore the best chance a person has of striking it rich is looking for the next new thing.

I’m verrry sleepy right now, but i’m not sure i believe this completely. If you look at the subset of people that strike out during the creation of a new product genre, yea, it turns out being there at the right time was essential. But what proportion of the most successful people came from that origin, and what proportion made their fortunes “the old fashioned way”, ie, Warren Buffet and Carlos Slim Helu?

and what proportion made their fortunes “the old fashioned way”, ie, Warren Buffet and Carlos Slim Helu?

Outliers has me convinced that a little unbiased digging into any successful persons history will reveal a number of factors which allowed them to succeed where others couldn’t. I still think talent counts but not nearly for as much as I did before.

It’s interesting to read the responses to this book (here and elsewhere). I would boil Gladwell’s argument down slightly differently:

  1. Hard work is a key component to success
  2. Environmental factors are key components to success
  3. A combination of hard work and the right environment is absolutely necessary to “mega-success”

In other words, you an get a long way with just hard work, or you can just be extremely lucky, and you can be successful. However, to be mega-successful, the stars need to align just right and you need to work your ass off.

Is there really anyone who didn’t know that before?

The phrase I’ve heard is “luck is being prepared when the moment comes”.

Along those lines I’ve heard, “The harder I work, the more good luck I have.”

It’s interesting to read the responses to this book (here and elsewhere). I would boil Gladwell’s argument down slightly differently:

Not to be cliche, but have you read the book yourself? He has a lot of interesting insights in there. You may view the overall message as obvious but many of the examples he cites were very revealing to me.

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Luck

  • Alan

I did, actually. Most of his insights were pretty cool (per the OP, I liked the hockey insight, for example). But in every single example I can recall, he’s talking about the mega-successful – whether it’s the robber barons, pro hockey players, or the tech billionaires. There were a lot of “that make sense – why didn’t I see that?” insights in the book, but, ultimately, it seemed to me that the book boiled down to “be in the right place at the right time, and work like hell, and you may be successful.”

Did I miss something? I’m the first to admit I read it on a plane between sessions of entertaining my two year old, so it’s entirely possible I did. :)

Aleck

Cool. No, if you read it and still don’t think it’s all that insightful then I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree. I think the book is larger than the overall point it makes because it made me look at the world in a different way. YMMV.

I read this a few weeks ago and found it fascinating. It’s a really interesting look at how often success requires being in the right place at the right time. I just wish he’d have spent more time exploring how we could learn from this data to make luck less of a factor.

I just wish he’d have spent more time exploring how we could learn from this data to make luck less of a factor.

There’s a lot you can’t control unless you can see a new thing coming and time your child’s birth accordingly. You can, however, time it so your kid is born in Jan if you plan to have them enter the NHL.

“It’s better to be lucky, than it is to be dead.”
Anonymous

What the fuck is wrong with people?