Pathfinder: Kingmaker


It looks like they finally, finally fixed the Pitax bug so you can progress. Also the Valerie bug. Unfortunately their patches have a tendency to require a new play-through. Also massively decreased load times and QoL so you don’t have to go into the Kingdom Management unless there is something happening.


I finally unlocked the kingdom management and noticed it’s possible to use some of my companions as advisers. Will I still be able to take them with me to adventures if I assign them to these positions?


Yes, they’ll still be up for adventures.


Awesome, thank you.


This game feels refreshing in its atmosphere and the world. It’s all dark fantasy nowadays, especially with Game of Thrones making people think that you can’t have a good fantasy without racism and fratricide. You still have tragedies here but those are all Shakesperian, entertaining strategies.

BioWare has stopped going that way since Knights of the Old Republic (or Jade Empire) probably, Obsidian and CD Project were always about “realistic” fantasy. Divinity series was light-hearted too but with DOS2 they too went into the land of warcrimes, lovecraftian horror and all that jazz.

It’s refreshing to go fight a magical mist that grows from evil spell with evil animals around and is not some sort of manifestation of local village tolerance of gender inequality.


Ok, now we know where you are coming from.


I realize that today it’s hard to not see malicious thought behind certain alarming phrases that pretend to be innocent but no.

I’m not talking about evil SJWs plaguing our games. I say that it gets tiresome when everything that happens in a game has some sort of dark story behind it. If you get a quest in a Witcher 3 game then you have to start wondering where will the twist come from. You’re never just killing a monster. You will always have a child murder, or rape, or murder out of jealousy, xenophobia, greed. Or maybe suicide, or betrayal. And it will all be cynical and lifelike, it will never be just an evil dude, those will be normal people in hard circumstances.

In P:K you have an evil dude who became evil cause his father was evil. You vanquish evil. Meanwhile, in an Obsidian game that looks similar, you have to choose between supporting various sorts of imperialist murderous organizations, which is an interesting choice but it loses its steam when almost every RPG since around decided that those good/evil choices are childish and everything should be morally grey now.


Huh, a rare appeal to return to the days of villains who have no actual motivation beyond being inherently evil.

Did you play Tyrant? That game had a generic evil villain so unmemorable that I don’t remember a thing about them. Including whether they were a male or female or indeed if they even appeared in the game at all.


From the patch notes:

Patch Highlights:

  • System : Loading times have been significantly reduced.

  • New setting : you can now choose to significantly decrease loading times in kingdom management screens at the cost of higher RAM and VRAM consumption.

  • Multiple difficulty improvements in Chapters 6 and 7 .

  • New feature : you can now enable camera following. Just double-click a character’s portrait or hit F to enable it and disable it by manually controlling the camera (WASD, arrow keys or pressing on the mouse wheel). Camera-following is also automatically disabled on battle start.

  • New feature : to save yourself a loading screen, you can now hover your mouse cursor over the table in the throne room, and you’ll see an exclamation mark if anything new has happened in kingdom management while you were gone.

  • The Storyteller now provides the total number of artifact shards needed to assemble an artifact.

  • Numerous visual and user interface improvements.


I get what he’s saying. Trump has gone out of his way to prove cartoon evil is very real, after all. And I find the “shades of gray” gotcha moments have gotten really tedious in many RPGs. It’s started to come across like the “both sides” fallacy, only purposefully constructed that way.


@Brad_Grenz, Yes, that’s a part of it. Well written villains by Obsidian or chosen BioWare games are great, but when you try to make every street thug justified then it gets tiresome. Everything has a twist, every decision has bad and good things about it. Writers who would make a perfectly good Conan the Barbarian adventure novel make a mediocre Dostoyevsky fanfic but still keep Conan’s aesthetics. “Both sides” fallacy is certainly here too because if you want every sidequest story to have depth it’s hard to do it justice and make a proper tragic villain and flawed good man.

I’ve also played Tyranny (I suspect that’s was @MisterMourning means) and it’s certainly on a cynical part of the spectrum. It has well-written NPCs and factions but it requires a lot of commitment from the player to understand them in a short time

Loading times reduction is godsend. Great, great.


I’m really tempted to deep dive on this response, but this isn’t the political forum, so I’ll bite my tongue. My summarized caveat to this, is that its too easy with human nature to completely disregard something we consider evil, when there may be a grain of truth to the point that can be acknowledged without justifying their ‘evil’.

If anyone is interested in exploring that though further we can create something in the political forum :)


A flip side of that would be that even if that can be accurate in many cases, I mostly play games to escape from the tiring march through endless shades of grey that is our current reality. Sometimes I just want to be able to point my flaming sword of lich-beheading +4 at some lich-y ass motherfucker and say, “I’mma kill that dude, cuz he’s EVIL” and he just turns bck to me and hisses “EEEEEVILLLLLL” before kicking a puppy.


Like button hit!

Though sometimes I like a good rpg that tests my moral code and maybe I get to learn something about myself…


David I am with you a lot 90 percent. But gosh I deal with endless grey all day… sometimes a little kickbutt on Sauron’s minions is what I need. That said I don’t particularly like the acronym “SJW” as it implies a negative to what a sane person would think are people that are just trying to secure people’s rights.

So I guess I am torn. Bottom line is I am with you but I also agree with AP usually on RPGs. I am not torn politically … but … maybe a bit in rpgs. Btw did you all notice? Huge patches for all three RPG releases last year --on the SAME day.


Pillars of Eternity 2, Pathfinder Kingmaker… Which is the third one?


Bards Tale :)
@KristiGaines Agree about the real world being grey. I dearly hated the time part of my job was to evaluate if cutting headcount was feasible in my sector. On one hand… job security and protecting my lively hood and my daughter’s quality of life… on the other it felt wrong to potentially throw people I respected, knew, and liked under the bus

Most rpgs don’t explore choices like that, thank goodness!


D2 thank goodness they don’t. Sometimes I get a quest in a RPG that reminds me what I do and I am not sure I like it. Then sometimes we get an RPG that does grey and good/evil pretty sophisticated – Knights of the Old republic maybe (the first one – KoTOR 2 was solid grey).

Alek yeah Bards tale got a huge patch today as well.


BG2 still has the best evil enemies imo. They are evil because they can be, often in part because they are really strong (And oh boy does the game do a wonderful job of portraying that power, better than any rpg out there imo), or they simply do not care about others while they are on their quest, which is more often than not a way to become even more powerful. They remind me of Sith, in a way. The best part of course is that these evil doers have realistic motivations, so it’s best of both worlds.

Like @Brad_Grenz mentioned, grey morality does get pretty tiring after a while, especially once it became a cool thing to include in rpgs. And so few developers get it right, most of the time you end up with two not very likeable sides which turns it into a game of choosing the lesser evil, or siding with whoever has the better rewards.


Holy crap this game is making it hard for me to roleplay LG. CG choices are what I’d have picked irl. Very interesting, I never felt like this in BG2 or any of the other popular isometric rpgs, the choice was always more clear cut in those.

This is a huge plus for the game.