Peace is anti-Christ

And in other news, people who run neighborhood associations are dicks.

Homeowner’s associations are so bizarre and more and more people live under them. They are essentially a replacement local government underhindered by constitutional restrictions. I guess Coloardo made the bold step of requiring them to allow the display of flags. Bold move, CO.

The triumph of ideology over rationality isn’t always pretty, but it is occasionally kind of hilarious.

Homeowner’s associations are measures to enforce what amounts to collective property value management. In HAs, Tom Hanks will never get to live next to the Adams Family and their dilapidated house. And actually the process of a residential street aging, depreciating, becoming more dilapidated, and having lower and lower income families move into the street are exactly the thing HAs try to prevent. The whole thing about one family that refuses to water or mow their yard, the house gets trashed, the value of the whole block goes down, … next you know half the houses are rented out to unemployed 20-30 yr. old males with lots of loud cars piling infront of their houses at all hours of the night, ect…

Of course HAs quickly become like schoolboards unless managed by a large corporation. And even then if so, they’re still creating cookie cutter 50s style developments with no room for individuality. HAs are essentially about a lack of trust in the owners; owners can’t trust one another to sort out problems or keep their houses in good repair. In this respect it’s actually quite different than the early suburbs of the 50s-70s, which were generally populated by the upper middle classes that aspired naturally to a more sophisticated lifestyle.

I went to my local HA because everybody on it’s board were moving away and the threat was that the local county would have to take over it’s responsibilities which would mean higher prices for the individual owners.

I then heard a bunch of suburbian nazies argue loudly about the length of the grass on our common areas and who’s fault it was that some rocks had fallen on a walkway (one man walked out in anger at this point). I then wished for a quick death… or at least the higher prices and no local democracy.

My bewildered neighbour is American and was shocked what people would waste their time on - I shall send her this link, so she can see that HA stupidty knows no geographical bounds.

On Wednesday, every member of the subdivision’s five-person Architectural Control Committee was asked to resign when they collectively opposed the decision by the board of directors to fine Jensen and Trimarco.

O.k. you win. Everything is bigger in the US included the levels of idiocy.
We don’t have any subdivisions and the lawyer the HA employ basically told the people arguing (politely) to grow up and get a life…

I’ve specifically avoided apartments in buildings with these kind of associations simply because of the amount of hassle normally involved.

There are good HAs and there are bad HAs.

Unfortunately, the bad HAs tend to be really bad.

HA’s are good for keeping those godamn portable basketball hoops off the streets and out of the backyards. You wanna shoot hoops go to the fucking park or get a Wii.

HA’s are good for keeping those godamn portable basketball hoops off the streets and out of the backyards.

I think I’d be inclined to tell someone trying to stop me putting something like a basketball hoop up in my back yard to go fuck themselves.

(or did my sarcasm detector batteries go dead?)

This sort of crap is why I will never live in a neighborhood with an HA or any sort of community “covenant.” How quientessentially anti-American…

And I hope she sues the crap out of them on First Amendment grounds. I can’t imagine the HA has deep pockets.

The First Amendment only applies to the government. HAs are voluntary associations of people. They’d still probably win in court though.

Housing Associations are very German. I don’t think we have them in England, or they are very rare, hence Nellie’s outraged reaction. The idea of other people telling us what we can and cannot do with our houses is an affront to English people, but perfectly normal in Germany, even if you aren’t in a Housing Association. Some apartments have contractual obligations that insist on a particular colour of curtain or blind.

In Switzerland I believe it is illegal to use the toilet during certain hours of the night, but in Germany such things are often written into the contract. For example, I am forbidden from using my washing machine, except from 8am to 8pm, and not between the hours of 11am and 3pm. I have no idea why the need for an afternoon break from my washing, but I guess Germans like to take a siesta.

If it’s covered in the bylaws, the HOA will win. They signed up for this crap when they joined the HOA.

I think they’d win by arguing it is a Christmas decoration. After all, it is a wreath put up during the “appropriate” time of year. If it were July, I agree with you the HA would probably win.

I don’t think we have them in England

They’ve started to spring up a lot more recently, but not generally to the degree that they would/can dictate when you use your washing machine or whether your kids can play in the back garden etc, especially in non rented properties.

The main reason I hate them is they tend to remove common courtesy. Neighbour blocked your driveway once? Don’t go talk to them, get an anonymous, snotty note sent to them. And in many cases the “actions” of these sort of groups amount to little more than bullying by the established residents. The case above is a classic example.

If I’m in rented accomodation then that is slightly different. I don’t expect my upstairs neighbour to play his Hip Hop at full volume at 2am, but even in my current flat we don’t need to legislate common courtesy like don’t run your washing machine at midnight or keep your music to a reasonable level late at night.

Now that I think about it, I can’t see the HOA having a rule specifically banning peace signs, they probably don’t allow “ostentatious” or “provocative” displays. So, yeah, the homeowner could easily win. Of course, who the hell would go to court over this, and who would be stupid enough to allow themselves to get sued over it?

A Colorado man is to blame for home owners associations.

By that logic, everything in a EULA is just fine and dandy. You agreed to it when you installed and played the game.

HAs “win” mostly because they end up having a lawyer in the HA who’s on their side and will work cheap or free, bogging the other side down in legal costs. Often, people who have the ability to fight them win because HAs have no interest in knowing what the limits of their power might be, and less interest in abiding by them.

HAs, by and large, are run by people who don’t like their lives and couldn’t win an election for Student Body President in High School, who now take the chance to lord power over fellow “students”. Based mostly around the idea that property value is something that’s only supposed to go up, and that is some kind of inalienable right.

Our HA (which is typical of HAs. That is, not a good one) has a rule that the trees in the space between the sidewalk and the curb have to be trimmed so that branches don’t hang lower than 6’ (or whatever the height is). Every year at the meeting, someone mentions that in their daily sub-walks they’ve seen a lot of trees with low hanging branches (translation: My neighbor, but I don’t want to come out and say it, so I couch it in vagaries). The board says “Please trim your branches”, someone tries to get a “have the HA hire someone to come do it, then bill the people that were too lazy” motion going, which leads to the mind-numbing argument, and then the board saying “we can’t enforce that”. Great, so why are we all here?

It’s my responsibility to keep my sidewalk clear of snow. If someone slips and falls on my part of the sidewalk, I’m up shit creek. This is all law at the township level or higher. Yet the HA decides it has to have bylaws about it and ways to enforce it. They’re not the ones who’d get sued if someone fell in front of my house. They have no meaningful money, and I do (called Homeowner’s Insurance). It’s stupid, petty, and needless.

My little anecdote: When I bought my house, all of the listing material specifically stated that it wasn’t part of/subject to a HA. Then I moved in, and in the pile of stuff the previous owners left behind out of kindness (hand drawn maps of all the trees/plants on the lot, manuals/warranty info for the furnace, stuff like that) was a copy of the minutes from the last HA meeting. Imagine my surprise, since I was considering HA-bullshit as part of my purchasing decision.

That’s interesting dannimal, I didn’t realize one could get forced into an HA if the HA rules weren’t laid out as part of a property purchase. Was it in the fine print somewhere in all the trillion pages you sign as part of a house purchase and you didn’t notice it or was it really concealed from you until the whole deal was signed and sealed?

If you did not purchase your land subject to a Homeowner’s Association then they can’t do shit to you. They would only have a cause of action against the previous owner for breach of promise to only sell to buyers who agree to join the HA.

Take the documents by which title was transferred to you and a copy of the HA crap to a lawyer in your state, if you didn’t fuck up and join when you didn’t have to join, then you might get to make a trip to Ace Hardware and put up the chain link fence for your new small business in unlicensed official WWI reinactment licensed unofficial gatorfighting.